Decanter's - testing for lead?

[TheVez2]

I posted a while back about finding some awesome decanters at antique stores. I was cautioned against this as leaded crystal decanters will leach lead into the spirits. But pure unleaded glass ones should be ok to use. So how do I tell?

Lead test kits for tap water are expensive and require sending off to a lab for results, and are single use. I have 6-8 decanters I need to test.

I've read about a "thump" test, where you flick the top of the glass and depending on the sound you can tell based on the sound, but it's not terribly accurate, except when you get a definite ring, you know it has lead in it. It just doesn't work well for low leaded glass and distinguishing from non-leaded.

Any other ideas out there?

 

[ReAndyMator]

There's a couple of ways to tell. But neither are easy to do at home.

Practically, look at a bright light through the base of the decanter. If it looks clear, it's probably crystal. If it looks green, it's glass.

However, you can always passivate crystal. Simply fill it with vinegar, and leave for a few days, then you'll be fine.

That's all the guys like baccarat/Lalique do before they sell us (I work for a drinks company) crystal decanters, which will hold whisky for years. I've done leaching tests for lead, and leaching is negligible after passivation.

 

[TheVez2]

I've done leaching tests for lead, and leaching is negligible after passivation.

Really? That would be amazing, and easy to do.

 

[Ace_Club]

There's a couple of ways to tell. But neither are easy to do at home.

Practically, look at a bright light through the base of the decanter. If it looks clear, it's probably crystal. If it looks green, it's glass.

However, you can always passivate crystal. Simply fill it with vinegar, and leave for a few days, then you'll be fine.

That's all the guys like baccarat/Lalique do before they sell us (I work for a drinks company) crystal decanters, which will hold whisky for years. I've done leaching tests for lead, and leaching is negligible after passivation.

I have found no scientific evidence online that suggests that what you write about passivation is true, other than for short-term contact. Can you provide any evidence?

 

[rider4life]

Sorry for the slight derailing... What does putting it in a crystal decanter do? Anything special? Just for looks? Just curious if it changes the flavours at all as I have a number of nice whiskeys on hand. I don't drink them quickly so a couple of my bottles are 10yrs old now. Is them being on the glass bottle that the distilleries put them in a bad thing?

Cheers,

M.

 

[TheVez2]

If it's a crystal decanter, then it can put lead into the spirit, which is very bad. Glass is ok. I'm trying to figure out if I have glass or crystal.

 

[mglindo]

Sorry for the slight derailing... What does putting it in a crystal decanter do? Anything special? Just for looks? Just curious if it changes the flavours at all as I have a number of nice whiskeys on hand. I don't drink them quickly so a couple of my bottles are 10yrs old now. Is them being on the glass bottle that the distilleries put them in a bad thing?

Cheers,

M.

The glass bottles are fine. The decanter thing is classy and makes a statement if you are having company or will finish it in a month or a few months. If it will sit in the decanter for more than that, oxidation (air getting in), can possibly change the taste profile. Better in the bottle it came in for the long term.


Mike

 

[langod]

There are test strips available for testing tap water for lead. Here's one: http://www.amazon.com/WaterSafe-Water-Test-Kit-Lead/dp/B000Q6QWZA) I think that if you filled your decanters with water, let them sit for a month and then tested the water in them, it might tell you if they're lead crystal.

Also TDS meters (Total Dissolved Solids) will detect lead as as a dissolved solid. If you know of someone with a good aquarium setup, they might have one. It won't say how much of the TDS is actually lead, (you just get a result of PPM of TDS) but you could test a sample, then put it in a decanter and let it sit for a few weeks. Testing it again a few weeks later would be a good indicator of lead if the number went up.
You can get a TDS meter for under $20 -- this is the one I use for my fish tank: http://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-TDS-EZ-Measurement-Resolution/dp/B002C0A7ZY


NOTE: I AM NOT A CHEMIST. This seems to make sense to me, but it is just my opinion. Please use you own judgement. Perhaps a real chemist will come in and lend some expertise.

 

[eezee]

While decanting is certainly very classy, I've always been a fan of keeping my liquor in its original bottle. Sometimes the bottle itself is unique and enjoyable, as in the case with Hendricks Gin, and sometimes I just love the label, as in the case of Epsilon Tequila. To each their own.

This thread has been very informative as I have never even thought of the possibility of lead leaching into liquor. Research well and be safe!!

 

[TheVez2]

There are test strips available for testing tap water for lead. Here's one: http://www.amazon.com/WaterSafe-Water-Test-Kit-Lead/dp/B000Q6QWZA) I think that if you filled your decanters with water, let them sit for a month and then tested the water in them, it might tell you if they're lead crystal.

I've looked at that one, but it's $12 and only tests one sample. It's not cost effective.

While decanting is certainly very classy, I've always been a fan of keeping my liquor in its original bottle.

I agree. Most of what I want to put in decanters is either in a plastic bottle or in an undecorative glass bottle. My decanters would class those spirits up.

 

[newo]

I have found no scientific evidence online that suggests that what you write about passivation is true, other than for short-term contact. Can you provide any evidence?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8157224

 

[Ace_Club]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8157224

Not having access to the article, I can only base this off the abstract.

The research is apparently only based on the age of the decanter (presumably assuming that the older a decanter is, the more liquid cycles it has held, and the more lead that has leached out of the crystal). They tested a 20 year old, 10 year old and new decanter and found 50, 163 or 1410 micrograms/litre of lead in the liquid after 2 months of storage. The CDC limit for lead in drinking water is 15 micrograms/L.

I guess you could argue that using vinegar to passivate the crystal is the same as aging the crystal. However, you would need some sort of equation to tell you how many times you would need to passivate in order to be assured that lead levels remain below safe levels for however long you are storing the spirit for in the decanter.

Without this sort of information available, why take the risk of ruining the spirit and your health? Just leave it in the original bottle. Just my two cents.

 

[newo]

This is a good read on the subject - sections 4.12 and 6.1

http://hub.hku.hk/bitstream/10722/36780/1/FullText.pdf?accept=1

 

[eezee]

I've looked at that one, but it's $12 and only tests one sample. It's not cost effective.


I agree. Most of what I want to put in decanters is either in a plastic bottle or in an undecorative glass bottle. My decanters would class those spirits up.

Ha! Put some Pepe Lopez tequila in a decanter and pass it off as Patron! I'll have to try that some time!!

 

[ReAndyMator]

Evidence? Beyond that it's what the big crystal producers do?

I've worked in the whisky industry for about ten years, and I've had lead levels tested from crystal decanters, which have contained whisky for well over ten years. In the 'dummy' (not treated) decanter, levels were high. In the passivated one, they were measurable, but insignificant.

Passivation works. You can buy pretty much any famous malt in crystal, and I guarantee that all the manufacturer will have done, is soak it for a few hours in an ethanoic acid solution. If it didn't, then us, and every other big whisky producer is in trouble.

 

[drphungschway]

Sure, passivation works...but only to a point. Leave an excellent port wine in your favorite lead crystal decanter for a month or two - even after passivation, and you'll be drinking excellent lead tainted port... Yum

Test your decanter to be safe... if it's lead crystal, use it as a planter or whatever and buy a nice lead free glass decanter. Don't drink out of anything made with 24% lead oxide... that's just common sense.

Check this out:

ABOTEX lead leach test kit $12 bucks - Special test Procedure (Patented Leach Method) – Use this procedure to quantify the approximate lead release in pottery/ceramic ware, fabrics (natural & man-made fibers), multi-layered paint or paint chips, mini-blinds, toys, children’s jewelry, Mexican candies, make up and candle wicks. This method is great to test practically anything for lead.

• Wash, rinse and dry the item you wish to test
• Fill the item with vinegar (or immerse the item/sample in vinegar). Allow to stand for a minimum 4 hours.
• Test resulting vinegar with Indicator Solution supplied in the kit.
• Compare color produced to the following chart.

(For a decanter, just for fun - leave the vinegar in there for a week... - note - any color change at all is unsafe - especially for kids or pregnant women)

 

[TheVez2]

ABOTEX lead leach test kit $12 bucks

This test kit looks perfect. I hadn't found any yet that offered multiple testings. Thanks for the response!

 

[drphungschway]

This test kit looks perfect. I hadn't found any yet that offered multiple testings. Thanks for the response!

No problem, glad to help out.

I guess the cost for the kit is actually 15 bucks or so...

I became interested in testing my decanter because my son gave me a really nice one that was brand new in a box. I threw the box away and a year and a half later I decide to put all my liquor in decanters because it's classy and looks great on my new oak bar. I was doing quite a bit of reading and searching - Amazon and Ebay... and came across a comment about lead crystal, so just out of curiosity I looked up whether there were any issues with keeping liquor in lead crystal decanters... and lo and behold, yikes!... lol.
Well, the decanter I have is sentimental - I wanted to know if it's safe so I bought one of those test kits.

Just as a side note, if anyone is looking for nice decanters and glasses, check out Ashcroft decanters and glassware on either Amazon or Ebay. Their products are quality and lead free... not to mention classy and artistic.

 

[TheVez2]

I have about ten decanters to test, so I bought the larger kit. It has 24 uses in it.


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