Coticule enough?

[Permit]

Hi,

A few years back I bought some swedish straight razors which were in good shape (no rust, the edge seems straight and so on) but far from shave ready. I'm thinking of getting these shave ready and try them out. In Sweden we haven't got many options, it's hard to find all the stones you guys talk about. The cheapest option for me would be an Ardennes Coticule Selected, 6-8k grit. Would that be enough? One store sells the Norton 4k/8k but I think the price is a bit too high for me (about $185).

I'm also thinking about getting a leather and canvas strop and I wonder if I should use some kind of paste on the canvas side of the strop?

 

[Legion]

Yep, a coticule and a slurry stone will take care of most situations. A coticule is all I use now (actually two of them, one fast, one slow, but I could get by with just one.)

You will need a leather strop, and a canvas/ cotton/ linen one is a good thing after a coticule honing, most users agree. I would keep the pastes off the canvas, and use it clean. If you want to try pastes, a thin sheet of balsa wood bonded to a flat surface is a cheap and easy option.

 

[Fuzzy Chops]

Hi,

One store sells the Norton 4k/8k but I think the price is a bit too high for me (about $185).

This should be well under $100

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=51817&cat=1,43072,43071,51817

http://www.straightrazordesigns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=37&products_id=1219

 

[mdarnton]

I have quite a selection of stones available because I'm a violin maker and have been accumulating them for 30 years, but for razors I've gradually centered on using just the coticule and the cheap Chinese 12K stone, and often not the 12K.

Coticules are unusual in that they can be aggressive or fine, depending on how they're used, and that when used almost dry with no pressure they burnish more than cut. What I do is the rough work with a mild slurry and lots of pressure, then to the 12K to refine the edge, then back to the coticule with no slurry and no pressure to buff out the 12K stone's scratches. That works really well for me.

I'm using a Coticule bout, about 50mm x 100mm, and that's enough stone for the way I do it. That didn't cost much at all.

 

[Permit]

This should be well under $100

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=51817&cat=1,43072,43071,51817

http://www.straightrazordesigns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=37&products_id=1219

One would think that it would be cheaper. But in Sweden I think that all this "exotic" shaving gear is really expensive. Proraso shaving cream is about $15 (in Italy they're less than €2, about $2.60). For comparison a pint of beer is about $10, average monthly salary in Sweden is about $4500.

I have quite a selection of stones available because I'm a violin maker and have been accumulating them for 30 years, but for razors I've gradually centered on using just the coticule and the cheap Chinese 12K stone, and often not the 12K.

Coticules are unusual in that they can be aggressive or fine, depending on how they're used, and that when used almost dry with no pressure they burnish more than cut. What I do is the rough work with a mild slurry and lots of pressure, then to the 12K to refine the edge, then back to the coticule with no slurry and no pressure to buff out the 12K stone's scratches. That works really well for me.

I'm using a Coticule bout, about 50mm x 100mm, and that's enough stone for the way I do it. That didn't cost much at all.

What is slurry? I feel I have got a huge gap of information, maybe I should have read up on this before I asked

The Chinese 12k is obtainable here, should I go for it as well as the Coticule or would a canvas strop do fine?

 

[Disburden]

If you want to buy a coticule, email Ardennes and ask for one FOR RAZORS.
Then in that email ask how they use it for a razor sharpening. You will get answers straight from the source.

For the love if God dont just buy a random coticule on ebay, online store, etc. Some can be frustrating to use, some dull a razor in slurry without sharpening it. Etc

Slurry is the paste you make on a stone with a smaller rubbing stone or a diamond plate. This releases particles of the stone in the water, thus a slurry.

 

[oakeshott]

If you want to buy a coticule, email Ardennes and ask for one FOR RAZORS.
Then in that email ask how they use it for a razor sharpening. You will get answers straight from the source.

For the love if God dont just buy a random coticule on ebay, online store, etc. Some can be frustrating to use, some dull a razor in slurry without sharpening it. Etc

Slurry is the paste you make on a stone with a smaller rubbing stone or a diamond plate. This releases particles of the stone in the water, thus a slurry.

Do you think it's a good idea that his first stone be a Coti?

 

[Fuzzy Chops]

Do you think it's a good idea that his first stone be a Coti?

My first, third, sixth and ninth stones were Coticules, but I would not recommend them to anyone else as a first stone.

For someone starting out and on a budget, how can anyone recommend anything other than lapping film?

 

[Disburden]

I love coticules and they are my favorite stones but they can be difficult to learn if you don't have a good one.

 

[xuzxuz]

$185? Good lord!

For your first stone you really want to get a consistent stone.
Why?
Because when you are having trouble, your first instinct will be to blame the stone.

With synthetics, there is an assurance that the stone works, and that it's most likely your form.
Try to have someone from US or Europe send you Norton or Naniwa combination stone.

 

[Disburden]

Synthetics all act the same. Your naniwa will act just like mine for example.
coticules are way different...mine will not be like yours at all. So it can be lonely seeking advise for your particular natural stone.

 

[Permit]

The Norton is a synthetic stone, right? If so I think I will go for that. I e-mailed both of the vendors Fuzzy Chops suggested and both of the replied within a few hours, so that's good.

Are there any Europeans here that have ordered from any of them? I'm a bit interested in knowing if I went all right.

Thank you all for your replies! Much appreciated!

 

[hillbilly]

Nortons are pretty foolproof and I love them. If ya want to pinch more pennies Whippeddog.com has cut down Norton sets and cheap 12k finishers.

 

[Disburden]

THe norton is a great synthetic stone.

You need to lap it smooth before use otherwise it creates a bad edge. If it's not smooth after one lapping, lap it again, and again, etc.

 

[Permit]

THe norton is a great synthetic stone.

You need to lap it smooth before use otherwise it creates a bad edge. If it's not smooth after one lapping, lap it again, and again, etc.

What can be used for lapping? Do I need a special stone for that?

 

[gary haywood]

with the nortons you will have to lap often especaily 4k side...I would recommend the 325 dmtC its brill and works very well. I have had one 5 years plus infact I brought mine not long after I got my first ever hone which was 4k/8k Norton... I even lapped my coticules and barbers hone with mine /leaves anice surface also ..gary

 

[Wid]

If you want synthetics go with lapping film. Cheap, no lapping and ridiculously easy to use.

 

[lindyhop66]

My first, third, sixth and ninth stones were Coticules, but I would not recommend them to anyone else as a first stone.

For someone starting out and on a budget, how can anyone recommend anything other than lapping film?

I agree get a smooth hard surface like a slab of glass of "marble" from the hardware store and lapping film 12,9,5,3,1,.3. Much cheaper.

 

[Proinsias]

Some wet/dry abrasive paper on a flat surface works fine for lapping on the cheap, the DMT D8C Gary mentions is a better long term solution.

 

[Disburden]

What can be used for lapping? Do I need a special stone for that?

I use the dmt 325 8x3" plate for lapping.
the norton lapping plate isnt flat, I wouldnt use it.
you can also use wet,dry sandpaper and water on a flat surface but I use the plate.