Cheap vs expensive safety razors: does it matter?

[Razorcan]

I have only used 3 razors in my ,almost,40 years of shaving with a DE razor:

The , expensive, Gillette Fatboy from the 60s my father gave me in 1980 when I started shaving shaved great...

That is until 2000 when I forgot to take it with me during a yearly stay in Berlin during which I bought a , cheaper,Merkur 34c...

That shaved me BETTER than the Fatboy...so it became my main razor (I kept the FB as a backup but never really used it again)

That is until this Christmas when my wife gifted me an,even cheaper,Fatip picolo that shaves me even better,and faster,than the 34c...so now I have TWO backups ,that I don't think I will ever use again since the Fatip kills them performance wise..

I don't know if an even cheaper DE razor will shave me better ,I guess in 2035 I will give it a try

 

[SCh5]

That makes me curious. Do you shave ATG with your Tatara and if so, how many passes for a BBS finish, how long does that BBS finish last and your best blade. Assuming, you shave for a BBS finish?

The Tatara razors are little talked about on the forum and its nice to see someone that has one and talks about it.

Actually ,I can shave ATG with only two razors:
My beloved Fatip Original Retro and with the Tatara Masamune.
My usual BBS shave with the Masamune is one pass WTG and one pass ATG .
I use mainly Feather blades when going for BBS .
Next shave will be done after couple of days ,usually .

 

[Esox]

Actually ,I can shave ATG with only two razors:
My beloved Fatip Original Retro and with the Tatara Masamune.
My usual BBS shave with the Masamune is one pass WTG and one pass ATG .
I use mainly Feather blades when going for BBS .
Next shave will be done after couple of days ,usually .

I shave ATG with all my razors. My Gillette Old Types, NEW SC and even my Gillette Tech all have enough rigidity to let me shave directly ATG first pass at 48 hours growth, but they have varying amounts of blade exposure so the efficiency varies.

My Fatip Grande does it easier than all my other DE's. From 48-80 hours growth with a Polsilver blade its one quick buffing pass ATG for a 12 hour BBS.

The Tatara with negative blade exposure would make that difficult, no matter the blade. I'll bet its smooth and comfortable though, if not efficient.

Feather blades were the first blade I tried a shave like that with. They dont cut as well for me as other blades though and that shave took 3 full ATG passes.

My GEM MMOC does it at 100 hours growth easily.

 

[Scaramouche]

That makes me curious. Do you shave ATG with your Tatara and if so, how many passes for a BBS finish, how long does that BBS finish last and your best blade. Assuming, you shave for a BBS finish?

The Tatara razors are little talked about on the forum and its nice to see someone that has one and talks about it.

I have a Tatara Masamune Dark SB, and it's a very nice razor - tight tolerances, beautiful finish, and it DOES hold the blade firmly and rigidly. It's very similar in size/configuration/maneuverability to my AS-D2, and actually adds a bit of aggressiveness to the shave that improves on the AS-D2's propensity to "skip" areas because of the very shallow blade angle. I don't really need to pay as much attention with the Tatara to get a smooth shave - I shave with 3 passes on every shave (WTG, XTG and ATG), and the Tatara gives me as close a shave as any other of my high end razors - I include Timeless, RS, ATT and Rex - with maybe a shade more comfort. It's a great razor, and again my best compliment is that I could use it for a daily shaver and not be unhappy if it was my only razor.

 

[Esox]

It's very similar in size/configuration/maneuverability to my AS-D2, and actually adds a bit of aggressiveness to the shave that improves on the AS-D2's propensity to "skip" areas because of the very shallow blade angle.

I was curious on the similarities between it and the AS-D2, thanks for replying.

 

[Scaramouche]

I was curious on the similarities between it and the AS-D2, thanks for replying.

Dimensions are actually pretty similar - the Tatara head may be fractions of a mm more narrow and about 1/8" shorter in length, and the handle looks to be about 1/8" shorter than the stock Feather handle. The safety bars on the Tatara are rounded on the corners, which just adds to comfort. The AS-D2 clocks in at about 3.2 oz, the Tatara at 3.1 oz. One significant difference is that the Tatara handle is proprietary, with sort of a screw-in friction ball joint, so as far as I know there are no interchangeable handles, but the stock handle to me is excellent - the "golf ball" dimples really do provide a sure grip, along with the black flat finish, even without the cut knurling of the AS-D2. Again, the shave is slightly more aggressive, but still one of my mildest razors, so I haven't experienced even the slightest irritation. I could probably shave blindfolded with my left hand (right handed here) with the AS-D2 and not do any damage, but I might not get a completely BBS shave. With the Tatara, I might not use my left hand, but would certainly get a BBS irritation-free shave. And maybe not blindfolded.

 

[SCh5]

Dimensions are actually pretty similar - the Tatara head may be fractions of a mm more narrow and about 1/8" shorter in length, and the handle looks to be about 1/8" shorter than the stock Feather handle. The safety bars on the Tatara are rounded on the corners, which just adds to comfort. The AS-D2 clocks in at about 3.2 oz, the Tatara at 3.1 oz. One significant difference is that the Tatara handle is proprietary, with sort of a screw-in friction ball joint, so as far as I know there are no interchangeable handles, but the stock handle to me is excellent - the "golf ball" dimples really do provide a sure grip, along with the black flat finish, even without the cut knurling of the AS-D2. Again, the shave is slightly more aggressive, but still one of my mildest razors, so I haven't experienced even the slightest irritation. I could probably shave blindfolded with my left hand (right handed here) with the AS-D2 and not do any damage, but I might not get a completely BBS shave. With the Tatara, I might not use my left hand, but would certainly get a BBS irritation-free shave. And maybe not blindfolded.

Me thinks that the Masamune is a fine european hi-end razor .
Almost same class - regarding design ,material & finishing quality and overall functionality -
as the Wolfman razors ,across the Atlantic.
I just only wish it was made of 316L steel instead of 303 .
Still,is way cheaper and much-much easier to obtain than a Wolfman razor.

 

[Esox]

One significant difference is that the Tatara handle is proprietary, with sort of a screw-in friction ball joint, so as far as I know there are no interchangeable handles, but the stock handle to me is excellent - the "golf ball" dimples really do provide a sure grip, along with the black flat finish, even without the cut knurling of the AS-D2.

I didnt know they were proprietary. Thats good to know.

They do look ...unusual, but I bet they do work well.

 

[mawashi]

My 2 cents but first, I agree with a lot of you guys' views.

To answer the title:
Cheap vs expensive safety razors: does it matter?

If the point is just to get a good shave then the answer is no. A $5 baili can shave as well as a timeless or wolfman in the right hand but, we are all different and YMMV.

However, if the point is to find the ONE razor to rule them all then it all boils down to value. What do u value in a razor.

In the relative short time since last Dec I have tried a karve, gc 0.84, slims, fatboy, new sc/lc, English Tech, baili 171, Futur, etc etc. But the first razor I would pick up is the English Tech with a Webber bulldog handle, followed by the karve B plate.

I love the sound of the Gillette English Tech and I love the quiet effeciency of the Karve B. The new sc and lc are super razors but I do not like the freeplay when I'm screwing on the handle.

So my fav razor is a cheap $10 GET and a $10 handle followed by a Karve lol.

 

[Parallax]

Seems this discussion has gravitated toward three particular razors. The only one of the three I've tried, the Fatip, didn't work all that well for me. It wasn't bad. Just not in a league with my favorites -- the CLG3, the Wolfman WR1 .94 and the Ikon Tech.

I think part of the problem is it's a shallow shave-angle razor and that's not my thing. The CGL3 and the Wolfman have wide sweet spots and seem to shave well at many angles. The Ikon runs best for me at a steep angle, which is my preference. The Fatip and the R41 both seem to do best shallow, which just doesn't appeal to me. The MMOC is completely shallow. I mean you ride right on the cap. Doesn't get more shallow than that.

 

[Esox]

The MMOC is completely shallow. I mean you ride right on the cap. Doesn't get more shallow than that.

You can use the MMOC at any angle from shallower than the design angle to riding nothing but comb. I've been using mine lately more steep than shallow, shaving by feel for the most blade feel I can get and varying pressure applied. I feel a lot of blade and very little comb, but no cap at all. It works very well but your technique really needs to be on point with a fresh blade. Very light pressure with a fresh blade to shave 4, then increasing pressure to, so far, shave 13 on a single blade.

The Fatip has the widest range of usable shave angles of any razor I've seen with the possible exception of the MMOC. From shallow marked in red, to steep marked in green. It all depends on the pressure applied. It could be used shallower or steeper than marked in the pic below, it all depends on the pressure applied to either the cap or the comb, not the blade edge, to make the skin meet the edge.

Guard span distance marked in red, blade gap marked in green.

Compared to the Gillette NEW SC that has a larger guard span distance and more blade gap but less blade exposure, which limits the available blade angles.

Razors with short guard and cap span distances combined with generous blade exposure and little gap will give you the widest range of angles because theres more blade available to use. Most razors that have a larger gap, dont have as much blade exposure because it isnt needed. The gap does the work instead of added blade exposure. I'm sure there are razors that offer both but they're few. You happen to be one of the few shaves that appreciates both.

 

[Raven Koenes]

Seems this discussion has gravitated toward three particular razors. The only one of the three I've tried, the Fatip, didn't work all that well for me. It wasn't bad. Just not in a league with my favorites -- the CLG3, the Wolfman WR1 .94 and the Ikon Tech.

I think part of the problem is it's a shallow shave-angle razor and that's not my thing. The CGL3 and the Wolfman have wide sweet spots and seem to shave well at many angles. The Ikon runs best for me at a steep angle, which is my preference. The Fatip and the R41 both seem to do best shallow, which just doesn't appeal to me. The MMOC is completely shallow. I mean you ride right on the cap. Doesn't get more shallow than that.

I know this is going off topic, but what else would you expect from BOSC where hijacking threads 'r' us. Mike (Esox), even though he seems to be coming around a tad as of late, extols the virtues of shallow angle shaving. If you have listened to his detailed descriptions in the past of how to shave with a Fatip Grande you may have been lead down the wrong road, towards a pond, with mud...and fish. This is because I'm beginning to think he's a duck as evidenced by his love of the MMOC which looks surprisingly like one.

Mike @Esox:

I on the other hand founded SASA (Steep Angle Shavers Alliance) where riding the guard is King. The two very razors that led me to create this alliance were none other than the Muhle r41 and the Fatip Piccolo. Someone suggested here on B&B that the r41 preferred a steep angle. That to do so offered a more comfortable shave without irritation. I tried it with my r41 and was immediately blown away by the results. Shaving atg became a piece of cake with the r41 as well. Another person said that Fatips preferred a steep angle as well. I tried it with my Piccolo and the results were astounding. I was also blown away by how much smoother it was than any other razors. I immediately, with the invaluable help of @Cal, created SASA. You should try steep angle shaving with those two razors. It may be a game changer (pardon the pun).

Don't be fooled by ducks. Be like more like a corvid and soar:

 

[Esox]

I know this is going off topic, but what else would you expect from BOSC where hijacking threads 'r' us. Mike (Esox), even though he seems to be coming around a tad as of late, extols the virtues of shallow angle shaving. If you have listened to his detailed descriptions in the past of how to shave with a Fatip Grande you may have been lead down the wrong road, towards a pond, with mud...and fish. This is because I'm beginning to think he's a duck as evidenced by his love of the MMOC which looks surprisingly like one.

Mike @Esox:
View attachment 952050

I on the other hand founded SASA (Steep Angle Shavers Alliance) where riding the guard is King. The two very razors that led me to create this alliance were none other than the Muhle r41 and the Fatip Piccolo. Someone suggested here on B&B that the r41 preferred a steep angle. That to do so offered a more comfortable shave without irritation. I tried it with my r41 and was immediately blown away by the results. Shaving atg became a piece of cake with the r41 as well. Another person said that Fatips preferred a steep angle as well. I tried it with my Piccolo and the results were astounding. I was also blown away by how much smoother it was than any other razors. I immediately, with the invaluable help of @Cal, created SASA. You should try steep angle shaving with those two razors. It may be a game changer (pardon the pun).

Don't be fooled by ducks. Be like more like a corvid and soar:
View attachment 952058

The point being, you dont need to shave anywhere near the design angle with any razor. You can shave very far from it if you want too and sometimes, that ends up working the best.

Dont get me started about ducks! lol

 

[Raven Koenes]

View attachment 952061

The point being, you dont need to shave anywhere near the design angle with any razor. You can shave very far from it if you want too and sometimes, that ends up working the best.

^^^See there he goes with that whole rational logical thing he does^^^^^

get me started about ducks! lol
View attachment 952063

 

[Parallax]

Am I seeing a raven or something riding passenger on that eagle, or do eyes deceive?

Mike, silhouette of the Mrs?

 

[Esox]

Mike, silhouette of the Mrs?

Sexy duck, right? lol. I have no idea how Rave can resist.

 

[Raven Koenes]

Am I seeing a raven or something riding passenger on that eagle, or do eyes deceive?

Why yes it is a raven. What one lacks in ability one can always make up for in ingenuity. Ravens can soar then flap, flap, flap, soar, then flap, flap, flap. Eagles can Soar and higher and longer than any bird, and it seems like ravens can do by default lol!

 

[mawashi]

Why yes it is. What one lacks in ability one can always make up for in ingenuity. Ravens can soar then flap, flap, flap, soar, then flap, flap, flap. Eagles can Soar and higher than any bird, and it seems like ravens do by default lol!

Ahem... Even a mallard can fly higher than an eagle... And we haven't started on vultures yet rofl!

 

[Raven Koenes]

Ahem... Even a mallard can fly higher than an eagle... And we haven't started on vultures yet rofl!

Yes, but Ducks soar about as well as a rock though. Have you ever tried landing on the back of a Condor? I'm not saying it can't be done but hey.

 

[Esox]

The MMOC would shave them all too! lol