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Charnley forest stone

chess1

chess1

when i said by the book.
i mean book says the best charley( tells name of the place) is without fault lines.in the picture left one size smallest one.
do i have that book no i don't have it but i have read and remembered. Now

ADRSPACH show the picture 's of your 4 stones i may able to help. Lastly my personal opinion please understand this my experience

the best result i did get from middle one. using with oil.
it did give smoothest edge i have get so far.
include escher, nakayama etc.
it took me almost 200 laps.
if you want to get fast cutting action on chrnley you will need to use water with slurry it speeds up a lot.
hope this helps.
i have checked edge by using 100x magnification and it does look worse then escher's or nakayama's final edge but i don't know how come shaves better??
don't ask me i don't know answer for it.
 
A

ADRSPACH

When my stones are cleaned I will post them all together. Today it will be just one. By any chance you can not remember the name of the book? And for me your personal experience is more valuable than the book. The only more valuable could be my own experience with these stones which I am just building.
About the stone in the picture:
I was told that it was Charnley but it looks completely different than the others I have and looks more like that one on the left of the Chess1 picture. By hand it feels differently (I would say smoother than my other Charnleys).
Size 215x50x 25-27mm (this is by far most rectangle stone of my natural ones)
Colour: Olive green/light grey foundation with thickly peppered dark grey spots.
It is very shiny even on sides of stone and copper coin did not make scratch on it. I did not use it yet as i got it just yesterday an top side has few scratches which I want to take out as well as it looks that it was used with oil previously and I am thinking of water.
If the stone is somethong different what is it? What do you use on Charnleys for making the slurry?
 
E

English

That hone may be a German Thurengien. It doesn't look like a Charnley Forest.

There is a picture of one here. http://www.mst-mueller.de/ you need to look under new product.

I have owned the MST hone and it produces a dirty black slurry when you lap the hone.
 
A

ADRSPACH

I have one of the Muellers Turingers and this stone is different. Mueller is much darker one (grey) colour only. The olive green is the same shade as on my Charnleys. I realy have to get proper camera. Tried to look on perfect edge but it gave me warning for virus attack. Hopefully they will sort it out soon and I can try and have a look again.
 
E

English

That's a very low price Kees.

The Charnley Forest hone is superb.

If you buy them and don't like them, I will buy them from you.

I have already posted how good they are. They are in the Japanese finishing hone league.

You can lead a horse to water................
 
K

Kees

Thanks English.

Here's some picks of the CF's the vendor sent me. He deals in antique tools. I haven't handled any of the hones.

The 16604 is 21x4 cm 45 USD
The 19275 is 18x3.5 cm 45 USD
The 12058 is 23x4 cm 55 USD
The 16251 is 15.5x2.7, the 12061 10.2.6 both 25 USD each
 
E

English

Kees,

Here are some photo's of my hone. It measures 275 mm long by 50 wide by 35 deep (10.75"x2"x1.3"). It is a very hard stone and the longer the better so you can get a good run on the stone. I would therefore suggest you purchase the largest stone available. The small stones will be a little slow to use.

I paid $160 for this one and cleaned and lapped it. The antique dealer thought the value was in the mahogany box as carpenters don't think much of the stone.

When I bought it, it had a coating of oil on the surface and was not smooth and flat. The oil came off by just wiping with a cloth and some white spirit followed by soap and water then lapping on 250 then 400,800,1000 and 3000 grit wet and dry sandpaper. The 3000 grit is not essential and makes no difference.

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Hope this helps.
 
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E

English

Kees,

I also found this picture
http://www.theperfectedge.com/stonemuseum.shtml
which looks to be very similar to mine

This discussion on the SRP forum is also interesting and talks about a grey coloured stone being of a more desirable quality. The pictures look more like the hones you have found.
http://straightrazorplace.com/forums/advanced-honing-topics/32991-charnley-forest.html

Incidentally, the inclusions on my hone don't seem to harm the edge at all.
The olive green under a microscope looks the same as an Escher but the Charnley is much much harder. The Escher being a clay, the Charnley feeling more like a slate in the hardness stakes. The purple bits feel the same as the green and the white sheeny inclusion looks like sintered glass but doesn't cause any harm that I can detect. Anyway if the grey is a better quality, all I can say is it must be superb. I like mine as it is. Its pretty, its effective and it isn't slow. The hone works the same as a coticule. If you need a slurry, I use a natural Japanese Nagura stone that I purchased here.

http://www.dick.biz:80/dick/product/711301/detail.jsf

You can also use lather or liquid soap instead of oil if you want some more suction and gluide but the best edges for me come using just water. If you have lapped the stone flat, the blade sucks to the hone and you can either apply pressure or be as gentle as you like to get the sort of edge you desire.
I prefer the edge of this Charnley to my Escher. (I think).
 
A

ADRSPACH

I have recently purchased few CH here in England and have to agree with English that they are expensive. Still working on cleaning them. That think about CH being hard slate type is interesting as I was shown the test how to recognise slate from Ch. Use copper coin and try to scratch it. Slate will scratch but Ch will not. Tried it and that stone which i showed above didn't get scratched.
 
L

littlesilverbladefromwale

Hi all, picked up a second Charnley at the car boot sale today, it's about 9 inches by 1.5 inches. It is a light yellow/green/grey colour and is very smooth even after 120 grit wet'n'dry. Will post pictures of both soon. 2nd one is softer and more perfect looking than the first find.
 
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A

ADRSPACH

My goal for today before i go to play hockey is to flatten and lap my stones that i can finaly chose which i want and which I pass to others.
 
E

English

Great find and nicely lapped.

Now that you have a good hone, you can either sell the other two or use the coticule to generate some slurry on the CF. If you don't want a slurry, you might use the coticule as a door stop as that one is quite a nice size.

Seriously, the razor should be at the 10K level before going onto the CF. i.e. the CF will finish the razor to a higher level of polish and a sharper edge than any coticule. The CF will not remove metal. Mine gives me an edge that is significantly better than an Escher. The bottom line is the shave feels better.

Don't be gentle on the hone. Start with pressure and you will feel the blade eventually settle into a nice smooth rasping hone. As it settles, ease up on the pressure and you will feel when the blade settles into a steady smooth glide and the hone sucks the blade down. That's all the stone will do, so stop. Go to a leather strop and then shave. Nothing else is necessary.

I have found that like with the coticule, I go through the process twice, first with a slurry (I use a japanese rubbing stone to create a slurry) and then the second time with just water. About 5 minutes work.

No need for pastes of any sort and what I love about the hone is no mess.

So you can set the bevel with 1000 grit wet and dry (I prefer wet because it cleans off any irregular dust/grit) move onto that old yellow thing you have got and then on to some British quality. Come to think of it, you have a piece of slate from Snowdonia that's might slot in the middle so that you can go British all the way. There you have it, probably the sharpest natural edge available on a razor today straight off the hone. No mess, no imports, no drain on the economy and environmentally friendly.

Don't tell anybody else though they think its a bad quality carpenters hone.
Best keep it that way, you wouldn't want to upset the synthetic hone manufacturers.
 
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A

ADRSPACH

You made my day. I was getting worried that I bought wrong hone and yours looks like mine. Maybe more expensive than yours but still Charnley in its best. How much rectangle it is all over?
 
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