Just to be clear, this is just your regular bathroom sink/counter type of silicone? So something like one of these?
Brush Knot Depth?
- Thread starter TheBlakeBishop
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Thanks, it's off by a smidge where I sanded the edge a bit unevenly but it works pretty well.
I would think as long as it's a waterproof silicone you should be fine. I just used what I had on hand from sealing a new peephole in our front door. I used just enough to leave a thin layer in the base of the hole, twisted the knot in until it hit bottom and gave it just a little twist the opposite direction to make sure the bristles were straight. A 24 hour cure is usually standard practice but ... c'mon, what guy can wait that long to play with new toys?Just to be clear, this is just your regular bathroom sink/counter type of silicone? So something like one of these?
Lmao. I hear you.
I have a few synthetic knots knocking around that I'd like to try out on some low cost handles. So it's good to know that I don't have to keep buying more knots and handles to try other settings.
I looked through this post a bit again and see badger knots mentioned most. Do you set a boar hair knot or a synthetic pretty much the same as a badger as far as loft is concerned? Or are there different loft ratios?
Boar is much stiffer and doesn't need to set deeper to improve backbone. That doesn't keep people from setting that low though. In days past many boar brushes had a lot more loft. As for the synthetics, it depends on the synthetic as some are more flexy than others, but for the most part they can be treated as a Finest badger. Others may have differing opinions.
Thank you for the feedback.
So boar would be more of an aesthetic preference and I will just have to experiment with synthetics. But they should be simular to a badger in most cases, at least for a starting point. Is that correct?
No, it isn't just aesthetics, seating depth and height of loft affects boar knots the same way it affects badger or horse. It's just that boar starts out with more spine to begin with. A good example of low lofted boars is the Zenith "Big and Scrubby" and "Short and Scrubby," found on ebay. The same seller carries higher lofted knots as well to give a full range of options, depending on your preference. I prefer the scrubby feeling, low lofted knots so whenever possible I buy brushes set at 2:1 to 2.25:1 (loft:knot diameter). I've done this with boar, horse and a badger/boar blend, they give the performance I'm looking for. My near future brush plans are for a 2:1 D01 2-band Silvertip from Shavemac to round out my badger collection.
Ok thank you for clarifying. I'm pretty sure I understand now.
I want to pick up several knots from Maggards soon, but they don't sell pure boar knots just they do have a boar badger blend. And I have heard The golden nib boar is just OK. Do you know of a good place to buy high quality boar hair knots.
I bought my 24mm badger/boar knot from Maggard, then sent it to Milton at Turn N Shave. He set the loft to 48-50mm in a custom handle we decided on and it's easily one of my favorite brushes. He's a great guy to work with.
Though I've never bought from either source, The Golden Nib (TGN) and Larry at Whipped Dog get good reviews for their knots and customer service. I would think if you explained the qualities you wanted in your brush, either of those guys could recommend a knot you'd be happy with.
Another possibility is is to buy a brush that has a knot you like, then remove the knot and mount it in a different handle. Lots of guys have done this with Omega and Semogue brushes, do a search in the Brush Restoration folder. Mostly it's just setting the brush on a pedestal of some sort inside a pot with a little water and then steaming it briefly to loosen up the epoxy.
Though I've never bought from either source, The Golden Nib (TGN) and Larry at Whipped Dog get good reviews for their knots and customer service. I would think if you explained the qualities you wanted in your brush, either of those guys could recommend a knot you'd be happy with.
Another possibility is is to buy a brush that has a knot you like, then remove the knot and mount it in a different handle. Lots of guys have done this with Omega and Semogue brushes, do a search in the Brush Restoration folder. Mostly it's just setting the brush on a pedestal of some sort inside a pot with a little water and then steaming it briefly to loosen up the epoxy.
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Annnnnd here’s a differing opinion lol... IME the downside to synths available for the home brushmaker is that most lack backbone in a big way. The only exception I’ve found is the BOSS and Gamechanger (both are black synths, probably the same knot from the same manufacturer) which I don’t know if the makers even sell these knots by themselves anymore. Even the black synth from Maggards splays with barely a touch and the tuxedo knots I’ve tried have far less backbone than a finest. These should be treated more like silvertip knots rather than finest/two bands and set at a slightly lower loft. Personally I think silvertips are for creams only, but that’s just another of my opinions so don’t take it as fact. Leave boar knots with a considerably higher loft, they have all the backbone one needs even upwards of 70mm IMO.
In other words, you’re going to have to experiment a bit, but that’s part of the fun!
The mixed badger boar from Maggards is on that I want to try. I have two handles I made recently and want to make two to four more soon and put different knots in each so synthetic and boar are likely candidates for at least two. I also have an old handle someone piffed to me that will most likely get a boar knot.
Thank you for the input.
I plan on using silicone and plastic washers and doing some testing. It will be interesting to see the difference in performance. Mostly trying to get an idea of baselines/starting point right now.
As long as the feedback has gotten more into opinions than when I posted before let me add that I like lofty brushes. One of my favorites is a 30mm Silvertip set with 70mm loft. It truly is a YMMV sort of thing. You may want to initially drill the handle deep and set the knot low using silicon sealer instead of epoxy making it easy to remove the knot and experiment with different lofts by adding spacers under the knot or removing spacers to dial in what you like most and then setting it in with epoxy.
On choosing a nice synthetic knot, I have made three brushes using the Maggards Black and White synthetic knot (black with white or nearly white tips). One for myself and two for others. One of the others I made it for declared it as his favorite brush. Using a DS Cosmetics handle and two coins under the knot is what worked for me with that knot.
On choosing a nice synthetic knot, I have made three brushes using the Maggards Black and White synthetic knot (black with white or nearly white tips). One for myself and two for others. One of the others I made it for declared it as his favorite brush. Using a DS Cosmetics handle and two coins under the knot is what worked for me with that knot.
It's absolutely a matter of personal preference, that's what makes it difficult to find the ideal brush starting out. People can offer reviews of brushes they've used, and that helps in knowing how specific models feel and perform but until each person tries a variety of different brushes and types of bristles, at different lofts, it's hard for anyone to know what they prefer - much less what their ideal brush might be.
Building your own brushes with deeply bored handles and different lifts, then experimenting with different lofts and knots may actually be a more cost effective way to discover what you like most. At least without lucking into a Brush Pass Around. If nothing else, it'll give an idea of which direction to follow.
Building your own brushes with deeply bored handles and different lifts, then experimenting with different lofts and knots may actually be a more cost effective way to discover what you like most. At least without lucking into a Brush Pass Around. If nothing else, it'll give an idea of which direction to follow.
@Graydog sent me a brush he made with the Maggard’s badger/boar. It’s a very nice knot with more backbone than a finest but also a bit of scritch. I fully expect the scritch to ease up with some use. It’s a lathering machine with pucks but a bit much for my sensitive skin to face lather with on a regular basis. All in all, I like it for what I use it for, and it’s a nice addition to my finest/silvertip/synth/boar collection that has a place all its own.
Well said, this sums it up entirely. For the cost of a well known exotic brush you can make a handful (or three) of various types of brushes and experiment with lofts until you find what you like. In the end you won’t have the “Ooo” factor or status of a well known exotic brush, but you will have some fantastic brushes all your own, tailor made the way you like them.
I should mention, I left a review on Maggard's about their 24mm badger/boar knot (j.oree67). I really was shocked how muddy the water got when I did my customary dish soap cleaning. It looked like a mud puddle on a dirt road and, while it washed up fine, I keep wondering if that much dirt could affect how well the bristles are bonded into the glue plug. Yesterday was it's fifteen use and it still throws a bristle every time I use it. I know that isn't much but most of my brushes stopped shedding entirely after the first few uses. I still think it's a great bargain for the price though and my particular sample may be uncharacteristic of the norm. I'm also feeling a bit less scritch now then when I first got it, hopefully that continues to mellow.
As I said before, I lofted mine at a 2:1 ratio (48 - 50mm) but after using it again yesterday, I'm thinking 2.25:1 (54 - 56mm) might have been an even nicer brush. Ah well, there's always next time.
That's a great way to look at it. I drool over the Thaters, Paladins, Simpson Sapphires, etc. but I just can't justify spending that much on one brush when there are so many great brushes on the market that cost less than half the price. The availability of such a wide variety of knots and handles (vintage, custom and re-knotting poor performers) and the ability to dial them in exactly where you want them make it even less likely I'll ever buy one of the Ultra-Premium brushes on the market... though I still get tempted at times.
One of my nicest boars is a simple little 20mm knot with a loft around 50mm. It's in a plain wooden (Beech, I think) handle with a basic ginger jar shape and came unfinished (no varnish). Many years ago it had the logo from The Body Shop stamped on it, that's long gone now. It a cheap little thing, not very dense knot at all but my wife saw it one day while she was buying something for herself and brought it home for me. I doubt it was more than $10 at the most but it gives the nicest face feel and whips up lather just as nice as my Shavemacs, Mondial, Semogue or Vie-Longs. Sometimes it's those unexpected sleepers that surprise you the most. I'd thought about using it as a travel brush but if I lost it I'd never find another one like it, it's been in my collection since '03 - '04. I've got plenty of easily replaced brushes to carry traveling - not that I travel much these days.
Chan Eil Whiskers
Fumbling about.
So, your brush is a Silverwolf?
It's a great handle and worthy of a nice replacement knot. Good job of it.
Happy shaves,
Jim
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