They work great for me in a Karve A plate, similarly to Nacet, Personna Red, Polsilver, or Feather. Pulls less than a Personna Blue on my tougher mustache area (which works fine too, just pulls a tiny bit). The 5 or 6 Bics I’ve used so far are consistent out of my 100 pack and were also good in the sampler pack where I first tried them. What a puzzle. Of course a Karve A is a super-mild thing, so nothing is “rough” for me, but the pulling and tugging others experience is curious.