Being fired in an at-will state

[jstutman]

Company had just laid off 200 people on Sept 11th. These individuals all recieved 10,000 in severence. However three days later 20 more were "fired" based on violation of company policy. They were offered a severence pay of only 6k.

These 20 employee's were to be 100% vested in the companies stock option plan just 2 days from the day they were fired.

They are all located in an at-will state

Do they have any options?

 

[life2short1971]

I would think so but not without a lawyer and a class action suit

 

[Obsessed]

You really need to speak with an employment lawyer in your state. The local bar association should be able to refer you to one, and I'd assume you'll be able to get a free consultation.

 

[kwk285]

When my job was eliminated a company 6 years ago, I had been with them for 3 1/2 years. I would have been vested at 5.

The company told me that the law at that time stated that they had to consider me vested since they were laying me off so I go the company's matching funds.

 

[joglander]

I don't know enough about the facts or the law to be helpful. But I do know that it is worth your while to consult an employment lawyer who specializes in employee claims BEFORE YOU SIGN ANYTHING. Don't cash the check and don't sign anything, and talk to a lawyer today. Make an appointment for this week. Usually the initial consultation does not cost anything. You may not have a claim, but you won't konw unless you talk to a lawyer. Good luck.

 

[jstutman]

I am trying to gather information for someone who was involved. I was told today, she did have to sign a document accepting the severence pay. There company attorney was there and told her she had no choice. It was then notarized by a notary.

 

[Dharion]

I think you're seeing for yourself when being told you wouldn't have a choice you're actually having one?!

 

[hifigeezer]

First, sorry about your job loss. Above all don't take it personally; it's the economy, not you.

When I was trained as a supervisor (in Arizona, an at-will state), we were told employees have the right to have their attorney review anything before they sign it. I hope that is true for you also.

If their attorney coerced or misled your coworker regarding their rights I encourage you to follow up with the US Department of Labor and any state agency that might help you.

It's disgraceful what companies will do for money. Given what you describe it would not surprise me to find a clear pattern of age discrimination which is against the law.

Good luck and hang in there.

 

[Obsessed]

I am trying to gather information for someone who was involved. I was told today, she did have to sign a document accepting the severence pay. There company attorney was there and told her she had no choice. It was then notarized by a notary.

For future reference, she did not have to sign anything then and there, no matter what the company's attorney told her. Think about it: presumably she signed a release (i.e., a document saying she can't sue the company) in exchange for severance pay. That's what the company wants -- freedom from the risk of being sued. If your friend had said "I need to have my lawyer look this over before I sign it," do you really think the company would withhold severance pay? No, because then they'd definitely get sued. Regardless, having one's lawyer review a document that affect's one's legal rights prior to signing it is standard practice, and the company attorney knows that full well.

Honestly, she may be screwed at this point depending on what she signed, but she should still talk to an employment lawyer ASAP.

If their attorney coerced or mislead your coworker regarding their rights I encourage you to follow up with the US Department of Labor and any state agency that might help you.

+1 Also talk to the employment lawyer about this.

 

[stobes21]

There's a pretty decent chance that by accepting the severance package your friend waived her rights to bring a claim against the employer. And the lawyer probably told her, accurately, that in order to get the severance pay she had to sign the waiver. This has become a pretty standard practice in business.

But I agree with others here that if she hasn't already she needs to see an employment lawyer ASAP. If you need a recommendation for one in Missouri or Illinois shoot me a PM and I'll send you some names.

 

[Obsessed]

There's a pretty decent chance that by accepting the severance package your friend waived her rights to bring a claim against the employer. And the lawyer probably told her, accurately, that in order to get the severance pay she had to sign the waiver. This has become a pretty standard practice in business.

To clarify my prior post, I agree that it's standard practice and aceptable for the company to require a release before providing severance pay in an at-will situation. My point was simply that she did not have to sign it at that very moment, and could have consulted an attorney first.

If your friend needs an attorney in the metro NYC area, PM me and I can suggest someone.

 

[stobes21]

To clarify my prior post, I agree that it's standard practice and aceptable for the company to require a release before providing severance pay in an at-will situation. My point was simply that she did not have to sign it at that very moment, and could have consulted an attorney first...

Absolutely true. We were saying the same thing in different ways. Severance in exchange for a waiver is a tricky thing, especially since people who have just been fired probably really need that money. So they give up (in some cases) the possibility of a lot more money (and justice, if you believe in such a thing) some time in the future in exchange for sure thing money right now.

 

[Obsessed]

Absolutely true. We were saying the same thing in different ways. Severance in exchange for a waiver is a tricky thing, especially since people who have just been fired probably really need that money. So they give up (in some cases) the possibility of a lot more money (and justice, if you believe in such a thing) some time in the future in exchange for sure thing money right now.

Well said.

People should realize that just by insisting that their attorney review the release before they sign it, they are not automatically forfeiting the right to severance. No matter what the company's attorney said to the OP's friend, I'm quite sure they would have happily accepted the signed release and paid the severance a month later, as long as they got the release.

 

[fifolo]

My understating is that in an at-will state severance is optional unless included in the employment agreement or in an agreement when employment ends.

 

[Trainer7]

OK, first things first...Sorry your friend is unemployed. I believe it was a friend and not you (after re-reading).
I am unemployed as well (laid off with a nice severance that has helped me survive).
I don't know about your state, but I am from NJ and if severance is being paid in a lump sum, you can begin to collect unemployment immediately (some people say you need to wait until severance is out, but it goes by state). Vacation time works differently.

As far as signing a severance release, mien had a 7 day "signer's remorse" clause. These were two excerpts from my "Severance Agreement and Release" and may help:

I acknowledge that my execution of this Agreement is knowing and voluntary. I acknowledge that I have received an adequate explanation of the benefits of the Plan and that I have had a reasonable period of time in which to consider executing this Agreement in exchange for receiving benefits from the Plan. I further certify that no coercion or undue influence has been exerted on me to execute this Agreement.

In compliance with the terms of the Age Discrimination in Employment Act and the Older Workers Benefit Protection Act, I expressly acknowledge that I have been given forty-five (45) days to review this Agreement before signing it. I also understand that I may revoke this Agreement for a period of seven (7) days following my signature of it and will send such revocation in writing postmarked within the seven-day period, properly addressed to <MY FORMER EMPLOYER OMITTED> and sent via certified mail, return receipt requested.​

The rest was very specific to the benfits my former employer provided.
BTW, I had stock options and was given 90 days from the termination date to execute them (never had the chance - under water).

Good luck to your friend (and me and the rest of us unemployed people) in finding employment (real employment, not settling for underemployment unless in dire need)!

Hope this helps...
Joe.

 

[noahpictures]

On Sept 11th? That's cruel and classless. They gotta fight back.

 

[DE Shaver]

Company had just laid off 200 people on Sept 11th. These individuals all recieved 10,000 in severence. However three days later 20 more were "fired" based on violation of company policy. They were offered a severence pay of only 6k.

These 20 employee's were to be 100&#37; vested in the companies stock option plan just 2 days from the day they were fired.

They are all located in an at-will state

Do they have any options?

As other have said, they can retain a employment lawyer, who can tell them what their entitlements are after severance. They shouldn't sign anything either until their lawyer looks into the matter.

 

[Woodash]

These 20 employee's were to be 100% vested in the companies stock option plan just 2 days from the day they were fired.

Unbelievable.

I am trying to gather information for someone who was involved. I was told today, she did have to sign a document accepting the severence pay. There company attorney was there and told her she had no choice. It was then notarized by a notary.

For future reference, she did not have to sign anything then and there, no matter what the company's attorney told her. .....If your friend had said "I need to have my lawyer look this over before I sign it," do you really think the company would withhold severance pay? No, because then they'd definitely get sued.

Bingo. Correct answer.

 

[ouch]

I know exactly what she should have done. PM only.

 

[joglander]

We don't know what she signed. Sometimes terminated employees are asked to sign to acknowledge recept of an offer of a severance package that starts a clock running for when she would have to decide whether to accept. She needs to get to an employment lawyer ASAP. If she violated company policy, they would not normally offer a severance package. She really needs to get to an employment lawyer.