Are some sharper than others?

[gull]

I was under the impression that the sharpness of a razor is solely determined by the hone job it was given. Then I read this on rusurpur's website

"First shave report .
This Iwasaki is NO joke. What a super sharp edge. By far way sharper than any western style straight I have ever used. That edge is deadly in a good way. For the first time I found a keen edge as sharp as a fresh disposable double edge blade. This razor definitely lives up to its reputation .
Again it's may times better than my Friodur 8/8, Wade and Butchers, Boker King Cutter, Dovo anything and my TI C135. No comparison at all. Those western style razors are all kids toys compared to the Iwasaki.
Thanks again Martin for the sale. And what a fabulous product for sure. As you can read I'm 100% satisfied with it after only one shave. By the way you can shave with either side just fine. Just the holding angle is a little different on one side is all . No big deal."

So are Japanese straights sharper than western straights? Or does Martin just do a good honing job?

 

[superbleu]

I have gotten a few Le grelots( both the 1/4 and the 3/4 hollow) from Martin and they have all had fantastic edges and gave excellent shaves.
The man knows what he's doing when it comes to honing!!!

 

[honed]

Martin is a very skilled honer, no doubt.
(And he finishes on Naniwa 10K, how many do that?!?)

That said, there is differences in razors.
And to make it even trickier, there is a difference between razors of the same model & maker too..
I've never tried a jap razor, but for instance, I find Swedish steel to be able to take a keener edge then Sheffield blades.
I have several Heljestrands MK31, & there is one amongst them that clearly stands out as the sharpest, no matter what stones I try them on.

And how you hone & what stones/pastes you use makes a huge difference.
As long as you have a razor with good enough steel, finishing with .25 diamond make a blade scary sharp, noticably sharper then Martins 10K finish.
But sharper isn't necessarily better.

It isn't the sharpest edge that is the best IMO, it's the most well-honed...
YMMV

 

[LarryAndro]

... But sharper isn't necessarily better. It isn't the sharpest edge that is the best IMO, it's the most well-honed...
YMMV

As Honed said, sharpness isn't everything. And, you should be warned that some of us don't think the sharper the better.

I honed a newly acquired straight razor this morning, and will shave later today. From experience, though, I know that I have to be especially careful the first few shaves. The blade will feel too sharp, and will cut easily if I don't concentrate. The shave will feel good when done though.

I know from experience, though, that I will like the shave better after several shaves. Something happens during those shaves that makes a great shaving razor a better shaving razor. After several shaves, despite good stropping or maybe because of stropping, the blade won't clip hair during the HHT quite as cleanly. It won't feel quite as sharp to the TPT. But, the shave... great!

Sharpness is overrated for me. But, again, this is personal taste. There are many for whom an extremely sharp Japanese straight will be very interesting.

 

[Seraphim]

You will note that review is from someone after their first shave with a new razor. It's the honeymoon period.
Japanese razors can indeed take a very fine edge, but so can western straights. There is a certain mythos around Japanese razors that I think makes up alot of allure. I haven't tried an Iwasaki, so perhaps they are he sharpest razors ever made. I had a Tosuke for a short time, and it did indeed take a very fine edge, but nothing earth shattering.
Anyhow, I'm just saying I don't buy into the idea that there is anything particular about Japanese razors. All razors are simply sharpened pieces of steel, no more, no less.

 

[honed]

You will note that review is from someone after their first shave with a new razor. It's the honeymoon period.
Japanese razors can indeed take a very fine edge, but so can western straights. There is a certain mythos around Japanese razors that I think makes up alot of allure. I haven't tried an Iwasaki, so perhaps they are he sharpest razors ever made. I had a Tosuke for a short time, and it did indeed take a very fine edge, but nothing earth shattering.
Anyhow, I'm just saying I don't buy into the idea that there is anything particular about Japanese razors. All razors are simply sharpened pieces of steel, no more, no less.

True words!

Japan has a somewhat mythical reputation when it comes to all things sharp.
No doubt that they have a history of excellent swords, knifes & all other sharp things. But all mystery aside, so does Solingen, Sheffield, Spain, Eskilstuna & the likes too.

It's also worth noting that many Japanese razors were made from Swedish Steel

 

[Seraphim]

True words!

Japan has a somewhat mythical reputation when it comes to all things sharp.
No doubt that they have a history of excellent swords, knifes & all other sharp things. But all mystery aside, so does Solingen, Sheffield, Spain, Eskilstuna & the likes too.

It's also worth noting that many Japanese razors were made from Swedish Steel

Not that you have any particular bias towards things Swedish or anything....

 

[honed]

Not that you have any particular bias towards things Swedish or anything....

Oh no, not me!
Sure, Swedes are the smartest people on the planet, devilishly handsome & friendly as Dalai Lama.
But that doesn't affect me, no Sir, I still look at Swedish Steel from a neutral standpoint

 

[ouch]

Some of my Japanese knives (Tojiro, Misono) use Swedish steel, and I love them. I don't think the steel has any idea where it was produced.

 

[huntmol]

Theoretically, yes, you could have the sharpest razor in the world that would be empirically sharper than any other - but would it provide a comfortable shave?

I think the quest for "ultimate sharpness" is a neverending journey, and people who strive for this will always be spending money on new razors, new hones, etc.

Find a quality razor, grab a decent piece of leather, get yourself a decent finishing hone (coticule or above is fine, no need for a 50,000 grit stone), and you're all set!

I honestly believe that working on refining your shaving, stropping, and honing technique is much more important than buying new gear.

 

[Thebigspendur]

Japanese blades are specialized in that they are asymmetric so the side with all the attention can be made sharper and where a western edge might just crumble the Japanese will do fine. So yes they are sharper.

As far as western razors go if they are quality steel I think they can be made equally sharp. I think the problem is there can be differences in hardness and grind which can make honing more difficult with some razors and many simply can't get them really as sharp as they should.

 

[Luc]

I didn't use a Japanese style straight so I can't comment on that. I do not know that honer, so I cannot comment on that either.

However, what I can say, even with Western style straights, some are sharpers, better edge, smoother than other.

A combination of honer, stones and probably the shaver itself give you a 'Wow, this one is sharper then that one'. I used my sharpest straight this morning. It's like a hot knife going through butter...

 

[thanks]

I've used incredibly sharp razors where I had to be extremely mindful when shaving, and they were okay. I've had rough but sharp edges, smooth and sharp, smooth but dull, rough and dull, and everything in between. My favorite is a Coticule edge, as to me it's not too sharp, and incredibly smooth. There are others who say it's not sharp enough, and prefer synthetic finished edges with grit ratings in the upper stratosphere.

As always, YMMV.

 

[Proinsias]

Some of my Japanese knives (Tojiro, Misono) use Swedish steel, and I love them. I don't think the steel has any idea where it was produced.

I've heard Pakistani steel can be pretty knowledgeable about it's production.