Another Lemon from Simpson/Vulfix

[Doc4]

I agree that this is an outstanding feat of customer services by thesuperiorshave but it should not be necessary. A vendor should not have to go through this much extra effort to avoid customer complaints due to lack of consistency by a manufacturer. I understand that these are hand-made and there will be some slight variations. However, it seems as though many issues get chalked up to being hand-made as opposed to owning up to inconsistent production. I feel that progress/vulfix might be losing many customer and/or vendors because, in the words of Forrest Gump, you never know what you gonna get.

I do think the frustration of most, like has already been said, is the fact that we know they can put out some incredible brushes but seem to roll out duds on a regular basis.

Man, this sure sounds like the 'bad old days' of Simpson's brushes, back before Vulfix took over. (I speak of the time after Gary Young's family was involved.) It was like playing "Somerset Roulette", buying either an uber-shedding, handle-splitting monstrosity, or the best brush on the planet ... you didn't know what you'd get until after you pulled the trigger.

I really appreciate Gary's comments above, and personally I'd like nothing more than that the Vulfix era of Simpson's brushes brings back the glory days of old. But I think Vulfix needs to get this problem ironed out quickly, so that the customer feedback can get 'out there' before too much damage is done to the brand image.

 

[JPDyson]

So the Somerset brushes were bad at first? Puts a perspective on this - but it kind of boils down to "caveat emptor" for now. You might get a great brush, and you might get something else.

 

[Act Appalled]

You just had to post this when I was getting ready to order a Berkeley. Hopefully someone comes through to remedy your problem.

 

[tbress]

You just had to post this when I was getting ready to order a Berkeley. Hopefully someone comes through to remedy your problem.

Order from superiorshave.com and look before you buy.

 

[mblakele]

So the Somerset brushes were bad at first? Puts a perspective on this - but it kind of boils down to "caveat emptor" for now. You might get a great brush, and you might get something else.

No, that would have been post-Somerset, but pre-Vulfix.

 

[SliceOfLife]

Disappointing that one has to rely on actual stock images of a brush to select one; it should be reasonable to assume that when you list a spec, that each item would adhere to it within a tolerance that doesn't dramatically affect performance.

A 50mm loft being set at 48-52, no problem. A 50mm loft at 45mm, however, is a 10% discrepancy, and we can all attest that it significantly changes how that brush will behave. Naturally, reviews/opinions of this brush become completely unusable, as what I comment about my brush with a 52mm loft being floppy or large on the face wouldn't apply at all to yours with a 45mm loft (here ignoring the discrepancies in SHAPE of the knot as well).

This isn't how Simpsons earned the reputation it had, but it's how it's losing it quickly.

My 3/1 Rooney Finest had a loft of about 42mm... that's a LOT more than 10% off advertised. Seems the rule not the exception.

Anyway, got a picture of the brush in question?

 

[Granaura]

Yikes! First I've heard about this... Pretty big investment to get something unexpected... Hmmm...

 

[kwigibocity]

And I'm pretty sure Jared is kicking out the bad ones he receives from Simpson, so if these are the good ones, then count me out.

We've never returned a brush to Progress-Vulfix. List all the inventory as its received at random; there's no selection process going on with the images, and surprisingly they all seem to sell well-short/tall, bulbous/cylindrical, symmetrical/asymmetrical.

Keep meaning to start the same thing with the Vulfix line, but there's so little variance to show in the 2233-2236 and 374-377 models, it is hard to fathom that they're made the same way as their other line.

I remember going to a shaving-centric shop in my first European trip, in '91, and I thought that the Simpsons stock on display had some pretty big variance within the models. It was a long time ago, but I think it was as much variance as any our images.

P-V has been so terrific with every instance of customer service for us that I have tons of faith in them and in their future.

 

[mblakele]

My 3/1 Rooney Finest had a loft of about 42mm... that's a LOT more than 10% off advertised. Seems the rule not the exception.

I think there is some historical variation at work here too, at least for Rooney. According to http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php/Rooney_Style_3_Shaving_Brush the loft is 44-mm for the 3/1, and http://www.vintagebladesllc.com/vshop/xcart/home.php?cat=156 also says 44-mm. In my own rotation I have two second-hand brushes (3/1/S and 3/1/F) which both measure 48-mm. My finest definitely came from Vintage Blades, and I was told that the super came from Classic Shaving.

Dipping into the archives, I see a 2008 post from Jim at VB (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showpost.php?p=507728&postcount=12) about getting Rooney to shorten the loft, sometime previously. Jim also speaks about this at http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?p=332694#post332694 in 2007, and mentions 10% variation from the Rooney-supplied norm. In http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=71235 from early 2009, a couple members measured 3/1 brushes at anywhere 50 and 55 mm. That's much higher than we see today.

It's hard to piece this together, but if your 3/1 was one of the very last of the finest brushes, it might have been made to a "norm" of 44-mm as stated by Rooney today. If so, then 42-mm seems like reasonable variation for a hand-made product: borderline, but probably acceptable. Or it might have been a "second". At http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1243036#post1243036 Jim seems to suggest that his very last batch of finest brushes were a bit out of spec, too.

 

[SliceOfLife]

I got it from Classic Shaving that spec'ed it at 55mm loft if memory serves... so pretty far off.

 

[mblakele]

Ah yes, and they still say 55-mm at http://www.classicshaving.com/catalog/item/2053630/2184242.htm - click on the "view product images" link to see a picture, which has a loft and handle size diagram in the corner. Also here's an archival copy: http://web.archive.org/web/20080507183523/www.classicshaving.com/catalog/item/2053630/2184121.htm. Maybe Classic Shaving hasn't kept up with the changes that Rooney has been making, over the years? It would be good for Rooney's brand to make sure that their reseller publish up to date information. I'm assuming that Jim's information is correct, of course.

Edit: I should tie this back to Simpson/Vulfix somehow. They do seem related to me: Simpson seems to be moving their norm to a bulb shape, and yet we still see online retailers with pictures of fan-shaped knots. For any brush, both the maker and the vendor play crucial roles in supporting each other's reputation. The maker sets standards and tries to meet them, and may have problems with quality control. The vendor sets expectations with the customers, and those expectations may need to change over time as the product changes. Ultimately both must stand behind the product and handle customer problems responsibly, or their reputations will suffer.

 

[73mountaineer]

With all due respect to to Gary's comments on what he sees in the way that Vulfix is handling the Simpsons brand, QC is QC. You set a standard and if the brush doesn't pass muster, you kick it back. They may have issues with getting the knots correctly formed and set, but these problem bushes need to stay in-house, not go out the door to become the customer's problem. The documented problems with Simpsons brushes here have run the gamut from differences in handle shape and size, extreme variations in loft and shape, and other odds and ends that one should never expect to encounter in a brush of this ilk. For God's sake, one guy even posted a brush with the Simpsons sticker stuck to the bottom of the handle because the handle was turned wrong and the sticker wouldn't fit anywhere else - how in God's name do you have an employee working in QC that thinks it is ok to that send out to a customer?!?!

We have retailers taking photos of their actual stock so that customers can pick a brush with no surprises when they open the box - that speaks volumes.

I own a Commodore that I absolutely love because I got one of the "good ones", IMO. It is a little bigger brush than I would like so I have decided to sell it. Out of my available options, I can say one thing with certainty, my next brush will not be a Simpsons. Rooney or Shavemac perhaps, but until Simpsons shows us that they have grabbed this thing with both hands and will do everything possible to ensure that another substandard brush never falls into the hands of a consumer, I am done with them. If they get it together I will happily buy another, but not until I see some hard evidence of that fact.

 

[Act Appalled]

Order from superiorshave.com and look before you buy.

I would love to, however they do not carry the Berkeley.

 

[SliceOfLife]

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/member.php?u=10201

PM him and ask him to get some with his next shipment.

 

[steveo]

A few years back I bought a "Duke" and was very disappointed. Lots of shedding and squint stamping so I sold it on. That put me off Simpsons brushes for a while. Last week I ordered a Berkeley from an e-bay vendor and couldn't be happier. The stamping is excellent , no shedding (so far) , very dense and just a pleasure to use. I have to admit when I ordered I was worried in case I got a "shedder" but it worked out fine. Sorry to hear yours wasn't up to scratch. Guess I got lucky.

 

[Gary Young]

No, that would have been post-Somerset, but pre-Vulfix.

Pre-Vulfix brushes were still made in Somerset - in a town called Ilminster. David Carter didn't produce at our Mill (Nimmer Mill), but in a small unit on a 'small business estate' on the outskirts of Ilminster. So they are still Somerset brushes just not Nimmer Mill brushes. (For the record)

Gary

 

[JPDyson]

I got it from Classic Shaving that spec'ed it at 55mm loft if memory serves... so pretty far off.

The current spec on 3/1 is 48mm I think; 55mm was the old spec - Classic Shaving STILL has that outdated graphic...

 

[EmptyB]

Out of my available options, I can say one thing with certainty, my next brush will not be a Simpsons. Rooney or Shavemac perhaps, but until Simpsons shows us that they have grabbed this thing with both hands and will do everything possible to ensure that another substandard brush never falls into the hands of a consumer, I am done with them. If they get it together I will happily buy another, but not until I see some hard evidence of that fact.

This sums it up well. This is what all well-informed consumers ought to do.

 

[Ignatius]

Well, an update as to the OP.

The vendor has offered to take the brush back and refund me in full. I have accepted.

Mark from Simpsons offered to replace the brush and seems genuinely concerned about these issues. I certainly wish him success in resolving them.

 

[sas71]

oh crap
just got my Berkeley last night. ill admit i did a few test lathers (4-5) and it did kinda scare me at the hairs it lost (around 10). ill have my first shave with it today.