I'm no fan of his neither, but he can still drive the wheels off a race car. Besides, I bleed RED....
2017 Formula 1 season thread
- Thread starter ouch
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I still think, if you had the exact same car for all the drivers, and said to them all "go out there and do one flying lap flat out", that Kimi would set the fastest lap most of the time. (that is a carrot on a stick for a debate)
But, I truly believe he gets distracted during a race. If he's in a fight for position he is usually fantastic, but just going through the motions of a "parade race" as F1 often is since the early 90's I can see why it wouldn't be much fun.
I know the F1 organizers are trying to bring back the excitement of yesteryear F1, and still keep all the modern safety requirements, but for me it still isn't working.
The best idea I can come up with is to invite 4 different tire manufacturers to provide tires and have a tire war. Maybe all the teams have to use 1 tire per race from each manufacturer for at least 20% of each race?
There has to be some way of getting the talent of the drivers more to the forefront like before as well. I know the last time they tried to limit computer control in the cars a certain red team kept cheating so the idea had to be scraped.
Let's face it, the most exciting thing to happen in F1 over recent seasons is drivers drinking from a shoe on the podium. F1 needs more characters and a bit more excitement. I hope the new ownership continue to develop the series, they have started well, I know it takes a bit of time so I will be patient.
But, I truly believe he gets distracted during a race. If he's in a fight for position he is usually fantastic, but just going through the motions of a "parade race" as F1 often is since the early 90's I can see why it wouldn't be much fun.
I know the F1 organizers are trying to bring back the excitement of yesteryear F1, and still keep all the modern safety requirements, but for me it still isn't working.
The best idea I can come up with is to invite 4 different tire manufacturers to provide tires and have a tire war. Maybe all the teams have to use 1 tire per race from each manufacturer for at least 20% of each race?
There has to be some way of getting the talent of the drivers more to the forefront like before as well. I know the last time they tried to limit computer control in the cars a certain red team kept cheating so the idea had to be scraped.
Let's face it, the most exciting thing to happen in F1 over recent seasons is drivers drinking from a shoe on the podium. F1 needs more characters and a bit more excitement. I hope the new ownership continue to develop the series, they have started well, I know it takes a bit of time so I will be patient.
nice narrative and I agree. To me Kimi gets overshadowed, although he is one of the most tenured of all the drivers, similar to Mark Webber, in the the "Team" concept from the manufacturer is more like what driver is the Flavor of the Day. Absolutely nothing against Hamilton, but it became boring Hamilton on the Pole, Hamilton Wins. I think that in large part the #2 drivers are so overshadowed by the race media, they just give up. Rossberg retiring after his win is almost like a middle finger to F1.
Agreed we need a little more "cowboy" in F1 and a bit less "Tuxedo", LOL
Generally, who ever wins the pole wins the race ? Right ?
Hamilton can drive, no question there. I just think he's a crybaby. I was kind of loving during the race when he was stuck behind Verstappen and when the crew told him that he had to pass he said, "what do you want me to do?" Pass him, dummy. Pass him. Easier said than done, I know...
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Often, the one who wins the race of out the first corner wins but even then, not always. They have this technology called, "DRS" (drag reduction system) that lets them lay down the rear wing if they are within 1 second of the car ahead. There are a few timing zones throughout the track that do timing and allow them to open the rear wind to aid in passing.
No love loss for Hamilton. What he did last year to Rosberg in the last race, unforgivable. To his own teammate nonetheless. I think one of the main reasons Nico Rosberg retired was because of Hamiltons tactics in that race. He's one hell of a driver, but a real jerk when it comes to racing tactics and etiquette....
Don't get me started on DRS! I think they should do away with the whole system, and those silly massive front wings which create dramatic turbulence behind cars.
Seriously, they should go back to single element wings front and back which are fixed, no movement of the wings should be aloud. (rant over)
As for Hamilton, well he grew up watching the master of terrible behavior on and off the track, the most successful F1 cheater ever Michael Schumacher. The things that man got away with just because F1 didn't want to upset the champion and Ferrari kept threatening to leave in order to create their own racing league.
It is horrible what happened to Schumacher after he retired, but his legacy in racing left behind is one that has taught a generation of drivers that bending and breaking the rules works.
What F1 needs is another Hunt, Villeneuve, or Keke Rosberg to spice up the driving. I'd even settle for another Nigel Mansell or Jackie Stewart. Sure Kimi is a character but he is reined in by his team, and this young boot drinking Aussie has a bit of character in him which I hope will come through.
The other thing missing in F1 is the maverick team owner of the past, since Eddie Jordan sold up the team bosses have been very robot like, stiff boards concerned about making money.
If anyone wants a taste of the "golden age" of racing, a great book to read is Touch Wood by Lemans winning Duncan Hamilton. It was very entertaining!
Seriously, they should go back to single element wings front and back which are fixed, no movement of the wings should be aloud. (rant over)
As for Hamilton, well he grew up watching the master of terrible behavior on and off the track, the most successful F1 cheater ever Michael Schumacher. The things that man got away with just because F1 didn't want to upset the champion and Ferrari kept threatening to leave in order to create their own racing league.
It is horrible what happened to Schumacher after he retired, but his legacy in racing left behind is one that has taught a generation of drivers that bending and breaking the rules works.
What F1 needs is another Hunt, Villeneuve, or Keke Rosberg to spice up the driving. I'd even settle for another Nigel Mansell or Jackie Stewart. Sure Kimi is a character but he is reined in by his team, and this young boot drinking Aussie has a bit of character in him which I hope will come through.
The other thing missing in F1 is the maverick team owner of the past, since Eddie Jordan sold up the team bosses have been very robot like, stiff boards concerned about making money.
If anyone wants a taste of the "golden age" of racing, a great book to read is Touch Wood by Lemans winning Duncan Hamilton. It was very entertaining!
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- #31
DRS is the dumbest idea in the most brilliant sport. Why give an advantage to a guy who's behind?
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- #32
Still hard for me to accept that Kimi, everyone's favorite whackadoodle, is the oldest driver in the field.
I would like to throw in 3 more names in there that definitely were characters and tremendous drivers, Alain Prost, Niki Lauda and the one and only Ayrton Senna.
Agree. What Hamilton tried to do was disgusting. Sadly, theres no such thing as a, "gentleman racer" anymore.
What would you prefer: no passing?
No, I said get rid of the stupid multi element moving wings, this will increase natural overtaking, shifting the focus back onto tires/brakes/power and driver talent instead of aerodynamics. Those crazy wings create so much turbulence behind a car that in order to overtake a car the driver behind needs some sort of major advantage to be successful overtaking. One former driver described it as something like driving up behind a transport truck doing 200 mph and try to pass it, then he said multiply the buffering wind created by 10x and that is what it feels like.
Have a look at this graph on the link labelled "Overtaking Trends": Formula One Overtaking Database
Wind tunnel design and very intelligent aerodynamic engineers in the early to mid 1990's made huge technological gains partly due to advances in carbon composites allowing their designs to become reality. This is great for road going cars as the tech trickles down, but along with computer driver aids it shifted the emphasis from the previously most important driver skill and mechanical engineering. It also massively increased the demand on funding in F1. Teams went broke or were forced to sell up as financial demands went up.
Great traditional teams like Ligier, Lola, Lotus (the original Lotus team), Dallara, Brabham, March, and Tyrell could not keep up with the increased demand for money. Some would argue that some teams held on too long like Arrows, Minardi and Jordan. Even teams with big financial backing like Honda, Toyota, Stewart, Jaguar and BAR made small mistakes in aerodynamic design which cost them too much money to quickly fix, and led to their demise (among some other behind the scene decisions).
Don't get me wrong, the brightest minds coming up with technological breakthroughs has always be one of the greatest things about F1, and has made it the dominate world motorsport it is today. But, and this is a big but, it also ruins competition. Organizers have to react to this with rule changes, which requires just as much brain power and trial and error. They'll get there. And we will all have our opinions on how they should do it, I just don't agree with the direction they are taking with the DRS
So, you think that the racing would be better if they took away downforce and made the cars slower?No, I said get rid of the stupid multi element moving wings, this will increase natural overtaking, shifting the focus back onto tires/brakes/power and driver talent instead of aerodynamics. Those crazy wings create so much turbulence behind a car that in order to overtake a car the driver behind needs some sort of major advantage to be successful overtaking. One former driver described it as something like driving up behind a transport truck doing 200 mph and try to pass it, then he said multiply the buffering wind created by 10x and that is what it feels like.
Have a look at this graph on the link labelled "Overtaking Trends": Formula One Overtaking Database
Wind tunnel design and very intelligent aerodynamic engineers in the early to mid 1990's made huge technological gains partly due to advances in carbon composites allowing their designs to become reality. This is great for road going cars as the tech trickles down, but along with computer driver aids it shifted the emphasis from the previously most important driver skill and mechanical engineering. It also massively increased the demand on funding in F1. Teams went broke or were forced to sell up as financial demands went up.
Great traditional teams like Ligier, Lola, Lotus (the original Lotus team), Dallara, Brabham, March, and Tyrell could not keep up with the increased demand for money. Some would argue that some teams held on too long like Arrows, Minardi and Jordan. Even teams with big financial backing like Honda, Toyota, Stewart, Jaguar and BAR made small mistakes in aerodynamic design which cost them too much money to quickly fix, and led to their demise (among some other behind the scene decisions).
Don't get me wrong, the brightest minds coming up with technological breakthroughs has always be one of the greatest things about F1, and has made it the dominate world motorsport it is today. But, and this is a big but, it also ruins competition. Organizers have to react to this with rule changes, which requires just as much brain power and trial and error. They'll get there. And we will all have our opinions on how they should do it, I just don't agree with the direction they are taking with the DRS
You think there was no "downforce" when wings were just a single element? The aerodynamic force created by a single wing which didn't move was incredible at speed.
Most of the elements on newer F1 wings are there to create disturbances meters behind a fast traveling car in order to disrupt the effectiveness of the aerodynamics of the car behind it. It was a great engineering (and mathematical) event negating the old fashioned "sling shot" pass.
I'm not against aero packages, I'm very much for making a car go faster. I am against trying to make opposition cars go slower.
I think you maybe, just maybe, you are trying to goad me and you really do understand aerodynamic theory.
This is one of my favorite shots from the current season, detail of the rear lower diffuser on the Williams:
For those new to racing and maybe F1, this is the type of thing we are talking about, the car in front, their aerodynamic wings disrupt the air flow for the trailing car, making the wings on the trailing car very ineffective:
Nice graphic.For those new to racing and maybe F1, this is the type of thing we are talking about, the car in front, their aerodynamic wings disrupt the air flow for the trailing car, making the wings on the trailing car very ineffective:
I'm in agreeance with trimming down the aero dependency. The bigger tyres are a step in right direction, trying to introduce more mechanical grip, but more needs to be done in this area.
DRS needs to go, in my opinion. There used to be actual skill involved in following a car and waiting for the right time to pounce, trying to force the guy in front into a mistake, maybe missing a breaking point. I remember the tension of Alonso v Schumacher at Imola, lap after lap of will be, won't he. Now you wait until the DRS activation, open your wing and it is mostly a guaranteed pass.
Having said all that after a tiny sample of 1 race, this year looks like it'll be a cracker. At this point I don't care who wins as long as it isn't the same person/team at every race meeting.
