Charnley forest stone

[chess1]

hi everyone this is my first post and i am hoping i am not doing something wrong.
i do have this stone it is 10 inch to 2 inch wide
would like to know what is worth it?anyone can help?

 

[crankymoose]

Welcome to B&B
all I can tell you is that it is an oil stone and a finer grade they used to be quite common in Britian and are comparable to Arkansas oilstones

 

[netsurfr]

Welcome to B&B!!!
might be ok for some really rough work but not useful to keep a fine-tuned razor in shape.

 

[Kees]

Welcome to B&B
all I can tell you is that it is an oil stone and a finer grade they used to be quite common in Britian and are comparable to Arkansas oilstones

Not quite. Just read this here: http://swingleydev.com/archive/get.php?message_id=130903&submit_thread=1

 

[chess1]

check this one out?please

http://books.google.com/books?id=LV...&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=5&ct=result

or this one?

http://tinyurl.com/6xpur7

my own experience is different.it does give exceptional edge if i use it after escher takes long strokes 150-200 with oil but that edge is a lot better then escher's edge?

 

[ADRSPACH]

More and more looking forward to try mine. hopefully will be here soon.

 

[chess1]

usually Charnley has couple different types(quality) they different from each other with colors and consistency.
Basically it has been used with oil.
you have to be careful what type oil you are going to use . there is if i am not mistake 1 type oil which book says never ever use it. i can't recall it.
i have use charnley in many razor's with oil, without oil, with water with slurry
The fastest cut was with slurry water combination.
The best edge come of from charnley is with oil to make at least 200 laps.Now after that if you use 100x magnification and check the edge -edge will look like worse then before but razor will give to you amazing shave. Why i don't know the reason. edge is not breaking down. it looks like has water bubbles in it.
May be that magnification isn't good enough to see what is going on . i can't say. I can say is shave is not comparable. smoothest shave you will get.
Lastly to use charnley takes time and patience if you are sharpening 1 razor it is fine but you are hone master etc. then it will not work.
hope this information will help.

 

[ADRSPACH]

That oil you can not remember is linseed oil which makes the stone to become harder.

 

[English]

I have to strongly disagree with some of the posts above and can only assume that the advice is based on reading the old carpenters tool books and not based on ownership, use or hands on experience.

If I had been trying to sharpen carpenters tools with such a hone, I would not have thought much of it. But a carpenter wouldn't enjoy using an escher or any other fine grit hone for that matter to sharpen a blunt carpentry tool.

I have an 11" by 2" Charnley Forest Hone. It is an exceptional hone for putting the final finish to a straight razor. It will polish and refine a razors edge in much the same way as other high end hones will. You use in exactly the same way as you would use a Belgian coticule. The honing surface is just harder and smoother, more like a Japanese hard surfaced natural hone.

I have recently re honed my regular razors. A 6/8 half hollow Puma. A 5/8 full hollow singing Boker, a 150 year old 6/8 Sheffield Wedge.

First, I ensured the bevel was flat with a 5000 grit Naniwa Superhone and then re polished the edge on the Charnley Forest. About twenty laps with a slurry and 10 laps with just water. I then stropped the edge on a leather hone with 50 laps. That's it. All the razors are shave ready and provide me with a close comfortable daily shave.

Most hones that I have used in the past require a final few laps on Chromium Oxide before the final leather stropping to make the edge smooth. I find the Charnley Forest refines the edge by itself. It is this fact that tells me it is an exceptional hone.

For straight razors, I would not recommend using the hone with oil. Yes, with a slurry, with liquid soap, with shaving lather or for the sharpest shiniest edge, with just plain water.

It takes a lot of work to take an old Charnley, remove the old oil and level a fresh working surface. The final surface should be velvety smooth and look like a mirror. Only such a surface will finish a straight razor in the way I have described. The hone is a natural stone and I am sure that they can vary, again like coticules.

Incidentally, I purchased my hone in England, in a high class antique shop. The antique dealer liked the mahogany box that the hone was in more than the hone itself.

I have no idea as to their rarity, but I have only ever seen one in the flesh and I bought it.

 

[chess1]

English if you are disagree with anything what i said please point it out. i would like to know. Trust me i won't get mad. only i find in your post different what i have said number of the strokes. i mention you need to do 200 laps . i had 4 charnley's now have 3 and they all 3 different type. if you like i can put up picture of them.they all slow cutter's.
Or i miss something? let me know please.take care

 

[English]

Chess1,

I agree with your post totally. If you use a very light stroke on such a hard surface, I can see how 200 laps will be necessary. You will probably be getting an even sharper edge than I am. I am happy with the edge I get after 30 laps.

What I don't find helpful is the comment from Netsurfr who said

"might be ok for some really rough work but not useful to keep a fine-tuned razor in shape"

This is wrong. The hone is perfect to fine tune a razor. Its the best finishing hone I have ever used.

The Charnley Forest has a very high grit level. I have compared it with a Belgian coticule, a thuringien, an escher, a spyderco super fine ceramic, a natural japanese suita and a synthetic Naniwa Chosera 10k. The Charnley Forest I have gives a better, sharper and smoother edge than all of these hones. There are not many hones which do not require the edge to be finally polished with a paste such as chromium oxide to get that desirable smoothness, but the Charnley is one of them.

I also find the comment from crankymoose unhelpful. He said

"it is an oil stone and a finer grade they used to be quite common in Britian and are comparable to Arkansas oilstones"

Well, it isn't an oilstone if you use it as a razor hone and the very best translucent Arkansas hones are generally considered to be very poor finishing hones for razors. It is nothing like an Arkansas hone.

I hope that clarifies my post.

 

[ADRSPACH]

I would like to ask Chess1 If he could present pictures of those 3 different types of Charnley as there are not many of the easily available and none to see direct comparison between them. I think it would help us all.

 

[chess1]

Let me explain this post a little . When i join this side BB i had 4 charnley stones already . i wanted sell one and i really didn't know any rules in this side . i just came in and ask the question . this was last year i think,At that time people come up and said what they think. They were responding to me.
After that i have sharpen a lot razor on charnley and i wont change what i said.
i have checked edge 100 times before and after charnley on 100x magnification.
Edge does look worse after i jump to charnley but that blade shaves wonderful smooth and effortlessly. Now i go to charnley after escher's. what is going on on the edge i don't know exactly with 100x what i see i am saying(early post).
About picture's i do have 2 stones in my house and 1 is not. Give me time in hour i will have last one. then i will make picture of them and post in here.

 

[chess1]

last one i don't own anymore.

 

[English]

Chess1,

Great photo's.

The one on the left looks like it might be a blue green escher.
The one in the middle looks like a CF with some oil in the stone.
The one on the right looks like a CF as does the smaller stone.

 

[ADRSPACH]

What a beauties. Thank you for listening to my request in such speedy way. I will post mine when they arrive.

 

[chess1]

From left to right
By book
1 st left one the best quality charnley forest.
2 in middle second quality
3 least quality cf
Now about oil in the middle. it is not oil this stone performs the best for me. it has handle i think made special for straight razors.
oily spots seems like empty air .you can see threw it.i have lapped this and it is in very good condition.
left one which you said is looks like escher actually is the best cf without fault lines.(no red lines or dots)only find in 1 mountain in england.
they by size left to right 9 inch,10 inch and 13,5 inch
Hope this information was helpful.

this is all i know . i am sure people out there have more information and better ones please come forward and let others to know.

 

[ADRSPACH]

I am a litle bit confused (sorry just a ... foreigner). Did you mean that the clean Charnley without red/brown/purple inclusions is better that those with such inclusions?

 

[ADRSPACH]

To Chess1. You mentioned in your post "by the book". Now was it just term of speech? Or you have a book about Charnley? Reason why I am asking is as from today I own 4 different Ch. stones and before I try them and pick one for me I want to find out as much as I can. I do not want to leave everything just on my feel as I am not that experienced.

 

[Kees]

I guess you best try them with a practice razor that needs a touch-up and see how you get on. Charnley Forest hones are very slow so you won't easily ruin the edge. CF hones are not widely used for honing so experience with 'em is very limited here and on other straight shaving forums.

Please let us know how you get on.