Pits and/or Inclusions in Vintage Trans Arks

[duke762]

I've just noticed this. I grabbed one of my poorly prepared, shelf queen, vintage Norton trans, to touch up my razor and.....I made the dang edge look like a chainsaw blade. Good Lord what did I do now????? It didn't feel anything. My 2 bestest shelf queen vintage trans Nortons have either voids or inclusions in them.

Looking at other vintage Trans Arks on the web, I see this quite often. Those black dots that you see are either voids or inclusions. Voids will fill with lapping material causing problems. I have no idea what inclusions are but I now know they can be a problem. I've seen actual sand pits in softer arks.

I decided they had to go, with extreme prejudice. I grabbed my cordless drill and a tiny, Harbor Freight, flame shaped diamond bit and gave them heck. Stick the point in the void, give it some revolutions. Still black stuff in there, it might float out. I tried electrical contact cleaner... it helped and actually cleaned up some of the shallow ones. There was still work to be done, crud filled black spots all over my very best hones.

Once upon a time, I had bought some Harbor Freight tungsten carbide micro drills. I grabbed a .070mm or about .027" carbide drill and went after the voids still filled with black gunk. That was the ticket! The perfect size, and the perfect drill material, to use on an Ark. Hand turned with my fingers, it cleared a the non translucent material away. Re dressed and ready to try. All cleaned up.

The heck with shelf queen's, I'm putting these 2 beauties to work. Time for them to step up.

 

[rbscebu]

You have an interesting way with whetstones .

 

[cotedupy]

I've just noticed this. I grabbed one of my poorly prepared, shelf queen, vintage Norton trans, to touch up my razor and.....I made the dang edge look like a chainsaw blade. Good Lord what did I do now????? It didn't feel anything. My 2 bestest shelf queen vintage trans Nortons have either voids or inclusions in them.

Looking at other vintage Trans Arks on the web, I see this quite often. Those black dots that you see are either voids or inclusions. Voids will fill with lapping material causing problems. I have no idea what inclusions are but I now know they can be a problem. I've seen actual sand pits in softer arks.

I decided they had to go, with extreme prejudice. I grabbed my cordless drill and a tiny, Harbor Freight, flame shaped diamond bit and gave them heck. Stick the point in the void, give it some revolutions. Still black stuff in there, it might float out. I tried electrical contact cleaner... it helped and actually cleaned up some of the shallow ones. There was still work to be done, crud filled black spots all over my very best hones.

Once upon a time, I had bought some Harbor Freight tungsten carbide micro drills. I grabbed a .070mm or about .027" carbide drill and went after the voids still filled with black gunk. That was the ticket! The perfect size, and the perfect drill material, to use on an Ark. Hand turned with my fingers, it cleared a the non translucent material away. Re dressed and ready to try. All cleaned up.

The heck with shelf queen's, I'm putting these 2 beauties to work. Time for them to step up.

Interesting, do you have a pic of this?

I've probably had 10 or vintage translucents, probably all Norton though some had lost labels, and they've been pure as the driven snow. One of them had one surface mark on it that I wasn't sure about initially, but turned out fine.

I've certainly seen sand pockets in soft arks though.

 

[duke762]

Here we go. You can actually see them, under the surface in the Trans stones. Little black pepper spots. The one labeled Norton had 10 on one side.

 

[Empire straights]

Interesting, do you have a pic of this?

I've probably had 10 or vintage translucents, probably all Norton though some had lost labels, and they've been pure as the driven snow. One of them had one surface mark on it that I wasn't sure about initially, but turned out fine.

I've certainly seen sand pockets in soft arks though.

Here we go. You can actually see them, under the surface in the Trans stones. Little black pepper spots. The one labeled Norton had 10 on one side.

I've never had one in a norton but I have had them in smith's stones that had very high sg. Didn't effect use at all. Flattening with SiC powder will get in there and grind this edge. A coticule slurry can help with this too.

 

[cotedupy]

Here we go. You can actually see them, under the surface in the Trans stones. Little black pepper spots. The one labeled Norton had 10 on one side.

Oh yes, how peculiar.

Dunno if I've got very lucky or you unlucky, but I've never seen that before on an old translucent. I'll keep an eye out for it.

Hope it you managed to fix alright!

 

[cotedupy]

(Actually maybe the one I mentioned that had a surface mark might've looked a bit like that. I think it was an old HM7).

 

[johnb65]

I have them on a "new trans" from Dan's! It has stayed in the box since I saw them, little pits with what looks like black "stuff" in there.

 

[lightfoot]

I’ve seen the same on a few of mine. I’m thinking left over SIC…..?

 

[Gamma]

Have seen plenty of tiny voids in Trans arks, they never caused harm for me but I can see how they might if the rim around the outside of the void was elevated. Some of Dans bargain/special stones have them. Dirt gets in them, looks dangerous. IME, they were not. But, never say never.

Have seen plenty of dots in trans Arks, never had one be toxic, but anything is possible I suppose.

Have seen thin pin-straight black lines in trans Arks - same thing as the dots, not toxic.

But... I know of two people that had recent issue Norton trans arks with those lines, one went all the way around the stone - almost looked like a glue line between two polished faces - he said it could be felt. I didn't get to check the stone out though. It was a Hard Translucent but it was shipped in a Sort Ark box... very weird.

Chainsaw edge sounds, to me, like the result of honing over badly dressed long edges.
But anything is possible when Mother Nature's sense of humor kicks into gear.

 

[duke762]

Yep, Gamma called it. Most likely lapping compound stuck in the voids. It was probably sticking up, out of the void while I was trying to use it. WD 40 does tend to float things. I can't believe I didn't catch it right away. It felt like a lint ball or cat hair on the stone. I had no feeling of crunchy or gougey to indicate I was messing up. Sure did a job on my razor though.

 

[captaincaed]

Mine has the same pepper flakes. I haven’t noticed any damage to edges, but the stone also doesn’t seem to leave a terribly fine edge. Marketed as a Norton HB8.