How does it fit in the progression? I’m interested in getting a coticule with the BBW. I hone with a 1-5-10K synthetic stones and then go to my natural finisher. Could I use the BBW with water after the 10K and then use the yellow side for final touches?
How to use a BBW?
- Thread starter BBS Kirk
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Most BBW is considered 3-6k abouts and slowish. You can use BBW and Coticule (or just coticule only) to sharpen a razor. Alot of information online and here about it. Google dilucot! I was plesantly surprised by the process compared to using my fairly complicated normal Synth 2k/5k/8k/12k. BBW/Coticule required way less stones (Used single natural bout 10) and was nice in the simplicity. I did BBW with slurry and good pressure, lessing pressure and slurry to nothing. Then same with Coticule. I havent perfected it but with a few crox or diamond paste strokes afterwards it is very nice.
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- #3
I got a great edge with a coti and oil. Wonder if I could use oil on the BBW side? I would use varying pressure.
You can use oil with the BBW, although the effect should be a little bit finer in both cases in using oil rather than water. If you have a combo stone, use it prior to the yellow side (but I suppose you know that already). Add a red-pasted loom strop for the finish and that might be all you need.
Water works good for the slurry management parts. Oil for final no slurry phase probably ok but Ive always stuck to water.
Yellow is almost always faster and finer than purple making it just not worth it. My opinion so others certainly differ. But not only is it less fine, but it’s slow on top of that.
I have a big 12” BBW/Pyrenees I keep in the shop I like to use for chisels etc but I think pressure factor makes it more effective. But for razors I think you will find yellow is better in all respects.
I have a big 12” BBW/Pyrenees I keep in the shop I like to use for chisels etc but I think pressure factor makes it more effective. But for razors I think you will find yellow is better in all respects.
+1. don’t overpay for the BBW.
BBW grit varies, same as coticules. Some bbw is easily fine enough to shave from. There are some over on SRP who prefer to finish on bbw rather than the coti side - you just have to try your particular stone and see. And yes, I have shaved from a bbw edge, but I almost always use jnats now.
I have a reddish bbw "La Lorraine" that I have shaved off of. Quite nice and sharp feeling, closer to an Arkansas edge feel than my coticule. I was plesantly surprised by it and plan to test it out more.
There was a coticule vs bbw blind test on Bart's site years ago that had a lot of people liking the BBW as I recall. At the time (and still today) I suspected they were muddying up the test with an unusually good BBW and/or unusually bad Coti and it was basically meaningless for a generic BBW vs Coti comparison. That said, it happened and I think someone archived the forums before it was taken down, so it's out there somewhere if anyone can dig it up.
From my perspective, La Lorraine is the equal of an avg coticule shave. Every other BBW I've tried was significantly below even an AVG coticule. And a good coticule absolutely demolishes an avg coticule.
Like LJS, I see no reason to use BBW except with tools/pressure where you don't want to gouge or dish your (much more precious) yellow coticule. And virtually all the vintage BBW's I've owned bore this out (any with wear were gouged and dished heavily showing that they were used with tools that did that, rather than razors).
From my perspective, La Lorraine is the equal of an avg coticule shave. Every other BBW I've tried was significantly below even an AVG coticule. And a good coticule absolutely demolishes an avg coticule.
Like LJS, I see no reason to use BBW except with tools/pressure where you don't want to gouge or dish your (much more precious) yellow coticule. And virtually all the vintage BBW's I've owned bore this out (any with wear were gouged and dished heavily showing that they were used with tools that did that, rather than razors).
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- #11
Thanks guys for the information. I will prolly get a combo coti in the future.
They used a natural combo La Veinette, both Coticule side and BBW side. And a single BBW layer as third stone.
I've found every BBW edge to beat all my Coti edges in keenness, easily.
Smoothness is another question, that's very easy to accomplish on a Coticule.
However some BBWs can provide the same smoothness, but I find it much harder to accomplish, it takes a thin mist of slurry to finish on, and that takes some experimentation with each stone.
My best ever edge altogether came from a natural combo BBW, the keenness I had never gotten out of any Coticule and it had the smoothness of the best Coticule edge I've ever had. So yeah, it can work and when it works it is really good.
I must admit it was a natural combo from a certain vein that really did it for me, others not so much; like it is with many Coticule layers. Some you like, some you dislike.
The same goes for any Coti, any BBW, any Jnat, any natural stone.
Though I would indeed say a BBW is not a consistent good finisher, but I find a lot of Coticule layers also not to be. But that's probably more a personal preference than anything; which anything shave related is. We're never taking about universal truths, but always about personal subjective tastes. Which makes discussions interesting, but always a personal opinion.
On German forums there are many shavers that use a BBW as finishing stone and get excellent results that will rival most Coticule edges.
You can always ask Ardennes to select a specific BBW for razor sharpening purposes and they will, but most natural combos already qualify for that.
