Artisan's Vs traditional

[Granite.Glasser]

D. R. Harris & Co., Ltd. has been crafting shaving soaps for over 200 years! I think they've figured things out along the way!!!

The chemical formula for "traditional" soap (as opposed to modern day detergents) is long established and is no big secret. Pioneers made tallow based lye soap from animal fat on the American prairies in a cast iron pot, and they weren't considered artisans. Ancient civilizations made beer and soaps. So called "artisans" use this same chemistry in small batches with much less quality assurance / quality control than established "traditional" makers.

 

[AimlessWanderer]

Umm... some of them are dying off. Like Palmolive. It's not sold in stores in the UK anymore.

Yes it is, just not Asda and Tesco. They probably dropped it for a higher margin product. Superdrug and Wilko still have them, as does Connaught.

 

[FireDragon76]

Also I should point out that not all balms are the same. My skin may like something your skin doesn't. Many love the iconic Nivea Sensitive balm, but I find it too sticky and not very absorbent. I bought the cheapest balm on the shelves I could find, just to have it in the bathroom after a rough shave, thinking I wont use it regularly. Oh man that stuff works goood for my face. Third of the price of the Nivea, plastic bottle, generic unknown brand, yet results. Just a happy coincidence.

EDIT: Afrodita - Slovenian cosmetics brand. I wasn't expecting anything great but this stuff is really good.

I tried a Bulgarian balm, Biofresh, recently... and despite the scent (rose) probably not being up to most peoples tastes, the weight is probably perfect for most men. It's not heavy at all, unlike Nivea.

 

[FireDragon76]

Yes it is, just not Asda and Tesco. They probably dropped it for a higher margin product. Superdrug and Wilko still have them, as does Connaught.

I suppose that's analogous to the situation in the US with some Barbasol products, many are relegated to discount stores and not the upmarket retailers.

 

[Granite.Glasser]

Hello Jim, Yes indeed unashamedly!

Amen to all the brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus!

 

[PreachTheWord]

For me, this is a useless argument. When I'm interested in a soap, it's quality and reviews are more important than whether they are mass-produced or artisan. When I'm thinking about trying a soap, I read the reviews (mostly on this site). If the reviews are good, it's pedigree (mass or artisan, old or new) won't matter. Same if the soap has bad reviews. Use what works for you and gives you joy. After all, that's what this is about.

 

[beddington]

For me, this is a useless argument. When I'm interested in a soap, it's quality and reviews are more important than whether they are mass-produced or artisan. When I'm thinking about trying a soap, I read the reviews (mostly on this site). If the reviews are good, it's pedigree (mass or artisan, old or new) won't matter. Same if the soap has bad reviews. Use what works for you and gives you joy. After all, that's what this is about.

For most people that's not allowed at all. I got out of shaving forums not that many years ago because.... drum roll

popular people on the boards were hammering down on younger people for not using the "right soap" the right "artisan razor" and even for "not holding the razor the right way". It was to the point that if you said that you could lather a soap or shave with a soap that no one on the board liked or was able to use... theyd hang your for a liar every single time. Even delete reviews they didn't like.

 

[FreshLook]

two main problems with artisan soaps :
A. Artisans have to constantly tinker with their soap base to get better performance to stay competitive, like what B&M did with their soaps. Same name, same scent but switched up bases and the difference was significant enough between the bases to mess with the customers. Shave soap is way more than just scent.
B. Artisans release soaps people love but can’t keep up with production. I am still waiting on Grecian horse A&E.

So its no surprise, we keep going back to trusty Tabacs and MWFs and Arkos, Cella, same base, same scent, same performance and always in stock !.

 

[AimlessWanderer]

So its no surprise, we keep going back to trusty Tabacs and MWFs and Arkos, Cella, same base, same scent, same performance and always in stock !.

I like known quantities. If I find something I like, and I want to keep buying it, I want it to be readily available, and the same every time I buy.

 

[naughtilus]

For most people that's not allowed at all. I got out of shaving forums not that many years ago because.... drum roll

popular people on the boards were hammering down on younger people for not using the "right soap" the right "artisan razor" and even for "not holding the razor the right way". It was to the point that if you said that you could lather a soap or shave with a soap that no one on the board liked or was able to use... theyd hang your for a liar every single time. Even delete reviews they didn't like.

Sounds like shaving themed "The Gulag Archipelago". Glad I'm not a member there.

 

[Erchy]

A very old classic.

It just works! I love it.


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[Steve56]

Traditional for me. No artisan exceeds the performance of the Italian creams or the French soaps, MdC, PdP, SMN, valobra, AdP, ABC, etc. Artisans are no where near close and a worse buy dollar wise.

Artisans may perform as well technically, but they don’t smell as good, and you’re buying a LOT of water at soap prices. you can shave for a year with a tub of MdC or CF.

 

[muzichead]

I like known quantities. If I find something I like, and I want to keep buying it, I want it to be readily available, and the same every time I buy.

This why I have stuck with Stirling Soaps!! Unless its a seasonal release its available year round same as it was the last time you bought it...

Artisans may perform as well technically, but they don’t smell as good, and you’re buying a LOT of water at soap prices. you can shave for a year with a tub of MdC or CF.

I've been working on a couple tubs of Stirling for over 2yrs now!! That's longevity...

 

[beddington]

Traditional for me. No artisan exceeds the performance of the Italian creams or the French soaps, MdC, PdP, SMN, valobra, AdP, ABC, etc. Artisans are no where near close and a worse buy dollar wise.

Artisans may perform as well technically, but they don’t smell as good, and you’re buying a LOT of water at soap prices. you can shave for a year with a tub of MdC or CF.

Your only part correct on this good sir.

cant remember the name of the company, but perhaps 4 years ago there was one American "artisanal shave soap and cream company" that was making their soap base in bulk and selling it to a good number of their "competitors" to scent to their own interests.

It used to be said on shaving boards that the American artisanal soap was just "one product with a different picture on the label. And a new label every few months to create a double the price limited edition seasonal release product craze"

 

[76vibrochamp]

Your only part correct on this good sir.

cant remember the name of the company, but perhaps 4 years ago there was one American "artisanal shave soap and cream company" that was making their soap base in bulk and selling it to a good number of their "competitors" to scent to their own interests.

It used to be said on shaving boards that the American artisanal soap was just "one product with a different picture on the label. And a new label every few months to create a double the price limited edition seasonal release product craze"

I'd be curious to know more about this. The artisan makers that have been around awhile (B&M, Stirling) are always changing things around with their soap bases.

It's part of why I stayed away from B&M for so long. It seemed like every time I finally decided to buy a puck, they would change the formula then I would decide on something else until reviews came out.

It's not something exclusive to artisan soaps, either. Proraso just reformulated their entire line to go with the new packaging. Vitos is going tallow-free for their shave soaps starting this year. And of course, there was that time about a decade ago where the British "T" soaps all went tallow-free and became effectively unlatherable. Even Tabac did a minor reformulation around 2014.

 

[beddington]

I'd be curious to know more about this. The artisan makers that have been around awhile (B&M, Stirling) are always changing things around with their soap bases.

It's part of why I stayed away from B&M for so long. It seemed like every time I finally decided to buy a puck, they would change the formula then I would decide on something else until reviews came out.

It's not something exclusive to artisan soaps, either. Proraso just reformulated their entire line to go with the new packaging. Vitos is going tallow-free for their shave soaps starting this year. And of course, there was that time about a decade ago where the British "T" soaps all went tallow-free and became effectively unlatherable. Even Tabac did a minor reformulation around 2014.

It was caties bubbles I believe at the time. They would always announce they were updating their soap base to their suppliers soap base the same day the supplier would announce the release of their new version of soap base in their own products.

Don't discount a persons has the ability to order any amount of melt and pour shaving soap base that they want. An American owned and run shaving forum has a part of their website were they buy melt and pour soap base and scent it up to "sell as our own creation".

 

[Bogeyman]

D. R. Harris & Co., Ltd. has been crafting shaving soaps for over 200 years! I think they've figured things out along the way!!!

The chemical formula for "traditional" soap (as opposed to modern day detergents) is long established and is no big secret. Pioneers made tallow based lye soap from animal fat on the American prairies in a cast iron pot, and they weren't considered artisans. Ancient civilizations made beer and soaps. So called "artisans" use this same chemistry in small batches with much less quality assurance / quality control than established "traditional" makers.

Actually, all the traditional makers (yes, even the hoidy toidy British soaps) have reformulated their soaps and always for the worse, i.e., cheapened.

I'd be curious to know more about this. The artisan makers that have been around awhile (B&M, Stirling) are always changing things around with their soap bases.

It's part of why I stayed away from B&M for so long. It seemed like every time I finally decided to buy a puck, they would change the formula then I would decide on something else until reviews came out.

It's not something exclusive to artisan soaps, either. Proraso just reformulated their entire line to go with the new packaging. Vitos is going tallow-free for their shave soaps starting this year. And of course, there was that time about a decade ago where the British "T" soaps all went tallow-free and became effectively unlatherable. Even Tabac did a minor reformulation around 2014.

Just because an artisan has reformulated their base does not automatically relegate their past soaps to garbage. As well, any improvement is minutely incremental at best at this point in the game. B&M has admitted as such.

Quit thinking that you must have the best of the best of the best as there isn't one.

 

[beddington]

if the best of the best artisan soaps were sooooo damned good as advertised......

Why are we common folks still buying Palmolive shave stick or Palmolive shave cream? Seriously, if barrister and mann, or your favorite. Were SOOO good then you wouldn't see these low cost products on the store.

 

[x79ftw]

Traditional for me, D.R. Harris, Valobra, Czech & Speake, and Boellis are my favorites, all have tallow and last a very long time. I probably have enough refills for each to last a life time. Most artisan soaps give my skin a reaction, i only have two in my collection that dont. PannaCrema Lavendotto was one of my favorite artisan soaps, but its long gone and discontinued, id buy the NUÀVIA line soap, but chances are the complex scents wont agree with my face.

 

[polanalyst]

My main problem with artisans is my inability to test the fragrance before I buy. With traditional, I can usually find most in-store to smell. I have now given up on blind-buying artisans based on reviews as the scent has often been too much to handle despite good performance.


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