Sometimes I see the Other Side’s Point

[KW Driver]

As for the AK... I’d pick a different variant and accessories. I prefer the Romanian with wood forearm vertical if going stock. I also really dislike their stock sights. It’s easily enough to paint the front sight and guard to use them without the rear for close work at night.

If I was seriously running an AK, I’d want a vertical grip of some kind. Anyone who’s fired more than one standard (30 rd) mag knows they heat up fast and the mag ends up being the vertical grip, reducing accuracy because it’s not as stable that tight to the receiver. The East German AK-74/AKMs with plastic furniture would get uncomfortably hot with half a mag of 5.45, much less 7.62.

I’ve seen Eotecs mounted on the gas tube and that’s probably as good as it gets, but I’m not a fan of Eotecs... and that was before I learned they weren’t quite up to milspec when they were sold to the mil and public. I don’t like holosuns after picking one up off a store gun rack and having to charge it under a light. And the dot is too big for my taste. I prefer a 1 MOA dot, and will settle for 2. The sight/bore offset on that AK is pretty big too.

I’ve been a fan of, and using Aimpoints professionally and personally since ‘94. I’m faster with one than irons, and these days with my eyes I’ve got tighter groups with them. They’re fine out to 300m... 500 if you can see your target and know your holds. Magnified glass beyond 300, and a 20”+ barrel would be advised.

Lights? Indoors yes, but environment dependent, they work just fine outside too. Best case, I’m 30 minutes from a cop getting here. After I/mine get a call in. I see no point in hitting all the lights I have and giving away my ability to maneuver unseen. So, a light on a long gun to ID targets? Yeah, I’m ok with ‘em. I really miss having nods and IR lights, and zeroed IR pointers, and 3-35 dudes with and alongside me. The only thing lasers do better than IR is illuminating targets for air assists to engage. But you don’t need nods to see a laser either.

I have an Aimpoint (and BUIS), and light on my defensive long gun. I have lights on my defensive handguns. I’m awaiting delivery on my next handgun that has an RMR cutout so that in the future I can transition to a red dot on my pistol as my eyes require it.

I have gone out of my home at night to investigate strange noises that didn’t sound like critters. Long gun loaded, and a spare standard (30rd) mag. and pistol with a spare mag.

Do most civilians who own a set up like this AK have any clue which systems are right for their applications? Not likely. They’re living out some super-ninja-mallcop fantasy at worst, or “if it’s good enough for the mil, it’s good enough for me” hoping and dreaming.

Use what you want, carry what you want, master what you choose.

 

[Lightcs1776]

In today's modern times my friend, if you walk out the door with your Mosin Nagant or Garand; and I walk out the door with my Colt M4, If today's Modern Millennials are going to laugh at one of us, my money would be placed on the fact, that they are most likely laughing at you.

And I enjoyed the movie 'Grand Torino' as much as the next guy.

M4? Yep, I really want one. It was my assigned firearm when deployed and is incredibly reliable. I love old firearms, but if I didn't live in NY, the M4 would be at the top of my list.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[KW Driver]

M4? Yep, I really want one. It was my assigned firearm when deployed and is incredibly reliable. I love old firearms, but if I didn't live in NY, the M4 would be at the top of my list.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

What’s your mag capacity at now, 7 rds?

 

[OldGnome]

.
Use what you want, carry what you want, master what you choose.

The truest words in this thread so far.

 

[Lightcs1776]

What’s your mag capacity at now, 7 rds?

It is up in the air. The courts ruled that seven rounds isn't able to be compliant due to a ten round magazine being the minimum standard. When I move South, leaving all of this behind me, I hope to obtain an AR-15 or M4, just for the nastalgia of the military days if nothing else.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[KW Driver]

You can’t legally own an M4 in the US. The best you can do is a pre-ban (pre ‘86) auto that’s on the ATF’s lists. I don’t even remember what licensing you’d require to own it, plus the tax stamp. I don’t need an auto, so I don’t care about the requirements.

 

[Acmemfg]

Only used a firearm in a non-sporting application twice.
After the dust settled I had four rounds remaining each time. I have no quarrel with the concept of higher capacity weapons though. Surely have zero interest in full auto weapons either. But good on those who have a preference for such.

 

[simon1]

View attachment 972683 Only used a firearm in a non-sporting application twice.
After the dust settled I had four rounds remaining each time. I have no quarrel with the concept of higher capacity weapons though. Surely have zero interest in full auto weapons either. But good on those who have a preference for such.

Have you heard the news?

I like revolvers.

 

[OkieStubble]

You can’t legally own an M4 in the US. The best you can do is a pre-ban (pre ‘86) auto that’s on the ATF’s lists. I don’t even remember what licensing you’d require to own it, plus the tax stamp. I don’t need an auto, so I don’t care about the requirements.

Actually, you can own an M4. While my Colt M4 is the LE6920 and doesn't have the selector switch, it was produced in Hartford Conn, the exact same as the military version, the exact same process, the exact same detail in quality with the exact same M4 Roll Mark.

And yes, you can legally own an automatic "title 2" firearm in the U.S.

Class III NFA Weapons / Title 2 firearms are not as commonly known nor as straight forward as the Title 1 firearms. All class III / title 2 weapons fall into 1 of 6 different categories.

1) Machineguns,

2) Short Barreled Rifles (SBRs),

3) Short Barreled Shotguns (SBSs),

4) Suppressors,

5) Any Other Weapon (AOWs) and

6) Destructive Devices.

All title 2 firearms are regulated by what’s known as the National Firearm Act or what we refer to as NFA. One could spend months reading about NFA but I’ll hit the major misconceptions… which are, contrary to the assumptions by many individuals AND even law enforcement, that NFA weaponry …

1) Is legal in almost every state. Most all 6 categories above are allowed in just about all states within the Continental United States. A few states restrict machinegun ownership, others may restrict short barreled shotguns (SBSs) or suppressors, etc.

2) One does not need to obtain a “Class III” weapons license to own. In fact there really is no such thing as a class III NFA weapons license. When a Title 1 FFL dealer pays what is known as a Special Occupation Tax, he/she then becomes a SOT that can then deal in NFA/Title 2 weapons. SOTs have several classes too and they are based on the type of FFL license you currently hold. The term Class 3 comes from when a normal Type 1 (standard dealer) FFL holder pays his SOT tax. He becomes a Type 3 SOT hence the term Class 3.

3) Transferring ownership of an NFA weapon – All NFA weapons regardless of category (machineguns, silencers, etc.) are controlled during their transfer from one person/entity to another. These weapons transfer to another entity on what is called ATF tax forms. Each ownership transfer MUST be approved by the ATF before the transfer takes place. This approval takes sometimes many months. Generally individual transfer is approved in 3-4 months, dealer to dealer in 3-4 weeks. When the ATF approves the transfer, they cancel a tax stamp and this is why you sometimes hear some say class 3 stamp. Transfers from/to individuals require a one time $200 tax stamp to be paid for EACH transfer (AOWs require just a $5 stamp). These are considered tax paid transfers and usually are on an ATF form 4. Dealers can transfer to other dealers using a tax free Form 3.

If a person buys NFA weapon(s) or item from someone outside his/her domicile (home) state, the weapon must be transferred 1st to a SOT holder within the buyer’s state, similar to a Title 1 firearm transaction. It must go to a FFL/SOT dealer in the buyer’s state before going to the buyer.

4) Making of NFA weapons. In 1986 President Ronald Reagan signed a bill that basically stopped the making of any new machineguns. The Firearm Owners Protection Act, which would loosen restrictions on gun ownership with the reopening of interstate sales of long guns on a limited basis, legalization of ammunition shipments through the U.S. Postal Service (a partial repeal of the Gun Control Act), removal of the requirement for record keeping on sales of non-armor-piercing ammunition, and federal protection of transportation of firearms through states where possession of those firearms would otherwise be illegal, also contained an amendment, The Hughes Amendment, (William J. Hughes D- N.J.) which prohibited civilians from owning any machine gun manufactured after 1986. All the other 5 categories (SBRs, SBSs, Silencers, AOWs and Destructive Devices) however can still be made, even by an individual, if he/she first applies for and receives permission to do so. They will file an ATF Form 1 (maker form) and pay a $200 make tax fee. A civilian can still legally own any machinegun that was created PRIOR to May, 1986 as long as they get approval on the ATF form 4 discussed above. Remember that no civilian can possess a machinegun manufactured AFTER May 1986 except for law enforcement and military so there is a finite quantity available.

5) Tennessee is a special state when it comes to Class III NFA weapons. Part of the Form 1 or Form 4 approval process requires that you need to get local Chief Law Enforcement Official (Sheriff or Chief of City Police) to sign off on your form. Well, several years ago, a bill was passed in TN that makes it a SHALL SIGN state which means the Sheriff or Chief MUST sign approval for your transfer unless there is something in your NCIS background check that would otherwise prevent it. No other state does this. Some officials have erroneously associated their approval with liability on their part. When in all actuality, the signoff in the ATFs eyes is ONLY to state that the individual has nothing negative in his or her NCIS check. Corporations (LLC, INC, etc.) and Trusts (Revocable) do NOT need LEO signoff or fingerprints (still need ATF approval) however they may have tax implications.

6) An interesting and widely unknown fact, since the NFA went into effect in 1934, there has only been ONE, yes, ONE single felony committed in the whole United States since 1934 that involved a legally registered NFA firearm. And it was committed ironically by a crooked police officer who went to a drug house and shot someone on the premises. He used his legally acquired UZI sub machinegun to commit the crime. You hear all the time of machineguns and sawed off shotguns in the news but these have all been by individuals possessing an illegal, non registered weapon. There are millions of records of legally owned entries on the NFA registry too, so it’s not like we’re talking just a few hundred or thousand potential individuals.

The (6) distinct types of Class III NFA weapons are …

1) Machineguns – Often referred to as full-autos, automatics, etc… any firearm which fires more than 1 bullet for each individual pull of the trigger.

2) Short Barreled Rifles (SBR) – Rifles with barrels less than 16″.
3) Short Barreled Shotguns (SBS) – Shotguns with barrels less than 18”.
4) Silencers (Suppressors). Silencers/Suppressors are never portrayed accurately in the movies. If the bullet speed breaks the sound barrier, you WILL hear a pop. Suppressors are meant to alter the signature of a weapon so that it sounds like something else and/or the sound heard doesn’t mark the shooter’s position as easily as a non-suppressed weapon. .22 cal firearms can be suppressed very well though. You can make them so quiet that the action cycling produces more sound than the fired bullet does. With other calibers, sub sonic ammo can be used to lessen the signature as the bullet leaves the barrel. Best analogy I can give is a normal suppressed 5.56/223 from an AR15 will sound more like a .22 cal. rifle being fired.

5) Any Other Weapon (AOW) – these are usually things that don’t meet the other criteria above. Put a fore grip on a pistol, guess what? You JUST made an AOW weapon and if the proper paperwork and approval were not obtained prior, you have violated NFA regulations and possess a contraband weapon that carries severe fines and penalties. Other common AOW classifications are these wallet holsters you see that are meant to be/could be fired while the weapon is still in the holster. Pen guns are another example.

AOWs are a little special in that the transfer tax for them is only $5.00. Ironically, the “maker” of the AOW still has to pay a $200 maker Form 1 fee just like he/she would to make a SBR, SBS or Silencer.

6) Destructive Devices (DDs) – these are self explanatory, but the ATF has classified several classes of shotguns now as destructive devices. The infamous ‘Street Sweeper’ shotgun is considered a DD by the ATF and falls into the title 2/NFA realm.

The ATF forms usually used in dealing with these weapons are …

1) ATF Form 1 – Maker Form – used by non manufactures to make NFA weapons – for civilians, only Short Barrel Rifles, Short Barreled Shotguns, Silencers and AOWs can still be made (after May 1986). The ‘one time’ tax stamp for this form is $200. Maker will received an approved form back from ATF and he/she can then make the item in question. Once made, if transfer of ownership is ever needed, this would be facilitated on a Form 4 below.

2) ATF Form 2 – Manufacturer Registration Form – used by manufacturers only.

3) ATF Form 3 – Dealer to Dealer tax-free form. Any SOT can transfer to any other SOT tax free NFA weapons he/she has in their possession/ownership. This is usually done when someone buys an item and it is transferred from a dealer in one state to a dealer in the buyer’s state to facilitate the approval/filing process.

4) ATF Form 4 – Tax paid to/from individual form – used when a NFA item is transferred TO or FROM an individual. Even if the individual transfers the said item to a SOT holder/dealer, there still is a $200 transfer tax. Once the SOT has it, they can transfer it back out to another SOT holder tax free (Form 3) or directly to another individual in their state on a tax paid (Form 4).

5) ATF Form 5 – Used to transfer NFA items to police departments for official use – tax fee transfer. Dealer use only.

6) ATF Form 5320 – Used in the Interstate Transportation of all Title II firearms. If you are traveling between states, you WILL need to fill this form out a few weeks in advance.
NFA weapons must remain in the possession of the registered owner so short of just a few exceptions; you may not permit anyone to have possession of your weapon without you being in immediate presence.

Here at Old Glory Guns & Ammo NH, we can make your NFA Class III weapons purchase painless! It’s easier than buying a car. We will walk you through the process, and assist in filling out the forms properly the first time, so there is no ‘back and forth’ with the BATF. If you have any questions on the process, or are unsure of what you need to get the process started, call us and one of our knowledgeable sales staff will help you!


NFA Class III - Old Glory Guns & Ammo

 

[Lightcs1776]

You can’t legally own an M4 in the US. The best you can do is a pre-ban (pre ‘86) auto that’s on the ATF’s lists. I don’t even remember what licensing you’d require to own it, plus the tax stamp. I don’t need an auto, so I don’t care about the requirements.

Interesting. My M4 (ok, technically it was the government's M4) was selectable between semi and auto (three round burst, if I recall correctly). I just assumed there would be a civilian version in semi only.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[Lightcs1776]

@OkieStubble I appreciate the clarification. I personally don't care for full auto. While I was still in the military, it was made quite clear that full auto only leads to errant rounds. However, I do like the M4 platform, as they are accurate, easy to handle, and also make a nice hunting rifle. I really wish they would stop with the nonsense about noise suppression (I hate calling them silencers, since they don't make a firearm silent). I use ear protection at the range, but additional noise reduction is always welcome.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[OkieStubble]

Interesting. My M4 (ok, technically it was the government's M4) was selectable between semi and auto (three round burst, if I recall correctly). I just assumed there would be a civilian version in semi only.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

There is.

 

[OkieStubble]

@OkieStubble I appreciate the clarification. I personally don't care for full auto. While I was still in the military, it was made quite clear that full auto only leads to errant rounds. However, I do like the M4 platform, as they are accurate, easy to handle, and also make a nice hunting rifle. I really wish they would stop with the nonsense about noise suppression (I hate calling them silencers, since they don't make a firearm silent). I use ear protection at the range, but additional noise reduction is always welcome.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Suppressor's are just a $200 tax stamp also. They dampen the sound and recoil very nicely.

 

[Lightcs1776]

Suppressor's are just a $200 tax stamp also. They dampen the sound and recoil very nicely.

[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[OkieStubble]

[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Shame you have to move from New York just to have the freedom to own and carry what you want/like. Upper New York is absolutely beautiful country.

 

[OkieStubble]

Have you heard the news?

I like revolvers.

I seen this on the 'History Channel.'

 

[machinisttx]

You cannot legally own an actual M4 in the US unless you are a licensed dealer and/or manufacturer of Title 2 firearms. Any full auto Title 2 firearm manufactured after May of 1986 can only be lawfully owned by the above, military, or law enforcement. IIRC, the M4 wasn't introduced until the 1990's, so it would be impossible for a normal citizen to legally own one. You could buy a lower receiver registered prior to May 1986 and put M4 parts on it, but that is the only option. I would recommend forming a Revocable Living Trust(talk to an estate attorney) if you choose to do this...it removes a number of hassles for you and any potential inheritors.

This is a battle rifle. Thought I had some pics of my L1A1 but apparently not.

Paratrooper/carbine version of the SKS and a Romanian AK I built from parts. I still have several other kits I need to build. Built one for dad too.

I have a mini 30 I got for free. I wouldn't waste money buying anything in the mini series.

And one of my favorites

The bayonet is removable from the block, leaving a glass breaker/standoff in front of the muzzle. If 22 rounds of quality 9mm hollowpoints aren't enough, it's stabby and heavy enough to be a good bludgeon.

Did someone mention revolvers? I have a few more than this.

 

[Lightcs1776]

Shame you have to move from New York just to have the freedom to own and carry what you want/like. Upper New York is absolutely beautiful country.

I agree. However, there are several factors. The cost of living here is just hard to take. I love the Adirondacks, and have had a great time hunting in them. However, when taxes in other states are as much as $3600 a year for property & school taxes, in addition to other costs, it is really hard to stay here.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[simon1]

I seen this on the 'History Channel.'

That is so sad. I'll keep the light on for ya.

I do like the M2 carbine with the selector switch by the receiver...those are FUN!

Actually, you can own an M4. While my Colt M4 is the LE6920 and doesn't have the selector switch, it was produced in Hartford Conn, the exact same as the military version, the exact same process, the exact same detail in quality with the exact same M4 Roll Mark.

And yes, you can legally own an automatic "title 2" firearm in the U.S.

Class III NFA Weapons / Title 2 firearms are not as commonly known nor as straight forward as the Title 1 firearms. All class III / title 2 weapons fall into 1 of 6 different categories.

1) Machineguns,

2) Short Barreled Rifles (SBRs),

3) Short Barreled Shotguns (SBSs),

4) Suppressors,

5) Any Other Weapon (AOWs) and

6) Destructive Devices.

All title 2 firearms are regulated by what’s known as the National Firearm Act or what we refer to as NFA. One could spend months reading about NFA but I’ll hit the major misconceptions… which are, contrary to the assumptions by many individuals AND even law enforcement, that NFA weaponry …

1) Is legal in almost every state. Most all 6 categories above are allowed in just about all states within the Continental United States. A few states restrict machinegun ownership, others may restrict short barreled shotguns (SBSs) or suppressors, etc.

2) One does not need to obtain a “Class III” weapons license to own. In fact there really is no such thing as a class III NFA weapons license. When a Title 1 FFL dealer pays what is known as a Special Occupation Tax, he/she then becomes a SOT that can then deal in NFA/Title 2 weapons. SOTs have several classes too and they are based on the type of FFL license you currently hold. The term Class 3 comes from when a normal Type 1 (standard dealer) FFL holder pays his SOT tax. He becomes a Type 3 SOT hence the term Class 3.

3) Transferring ownership of an NFA weapon – All NFA weapons regardless of category (machineguns, silencers, etc.) are controlled during their transfer from one person/entity to another. These weapons transfer to another entity on what is called ATF tax forms. Each ownership transfer MUST be approved by the ATF before the transfer takes place. This approval takes sometimes many months. Generally individual transfer is approved in 3-4 months, dealer to dealer in 3-4 weeks. When the ATF approves the transfer, they cancel a tax stamp and this is why you sometimes hear some say class 3 stamp. Transfers from/to individuals require a one time $200 tax stamp to be paid for EACH transfer (AOWs require just a $5 stamp). These are considered tax paid transfers and usually are on an ATF form 4. Dealers can transfer to other dealers using a tax free Form 3.

If a person buys NFA weapon(s) or item from someone outside his/her domicile (home) state, the weapon must be transferred 1st to a SOT holder within the buyer’s state, similar to a Title 1 firearm transaction. It must go to a FFL/SOT dealer in the buyer’s state before going to the buyer.

4) Making of NFA weapons. In 1986 President Ronald Reagan signed a bill that basically stopped the making of any new machineguns. The Firearm Owners Protection Act, which would loosen restrictions on gun ownership with the reopening of interstate sales of long guns on a limited basis, legalization of ammunition shipments through the U.S. Postal Service (a partial repeal of the Gun Control Act), removal of the requirement for record keeping on sales of non-armor-piercing ammunition, and federal protection of transportation of firearms through states where possession of those firearms would otherwise be illegal, also contained an amendment, The Hughes Amendment, (William J. Hughes D- N.J.) which prohibited civilians from owning any machine gun manufactured after 1986. All the other 5 categories (SBRs, SBSs, Silencers, AOWs and Destructive Devices) however can still be made, even by an individual, if he/she first applies for and receives permission to do so. They will file an ATF Form 1 (maker form) and pay a $200 make tax fee. A civilian can still legally own any machinegun that was created PRIOR to May, 1986 as long as they get approval on the ATF form 4 discussed above. Remember that no civilian can possess a machinegun manufactured AFTER May 1986 except for law enforcement and military so there is a finite quantity available.

5) Tennessee is a special state when it comes to Class III NFA weapons. Part of the Form 1 or Form 4 approval process requires that you need to get local Chief Law Enforcement Official (Sheriff or Chief of City Police) to sign off on your form. Well, several years ago, a bill was passed in TN that makes it a SHALL SIGN state which means the Sheriff or Chief MUST sign approval for your transfer unless there is something in your NCIS background check that would otherwise prevent it. No other state does this. Some officials have erroneously associated their approval with liability on their part. When in all actuality, the signoff in the ATFs eyes is ONLY to state that the individual has nothing negative in his or her NCIS check. Corporations (LLC, INC, etc.) and Trusts (Revocable) do NOT need LEO signoff or fingerprints (still need ATF approval) however they may have tax implications.

6) An interesting and widely unknown fact, since the NFA went into effect in 1934, there has only been ONE, yes, ONE single felony committed in the whole United States since 1934 that involved a legally registered NFA firearm. And it was committed ironically by a crooked police officer who went to a drug house and shot someone on the premises. He used his legally acquired UZI sub machinegun to commit the crime. You hear all the time of machineguns and sawed off shotguns in the news but these have all been by individuals possessing an illegal, non registered weapon. There are millions of records of legally owned entries on the NFA registry too, so it’s not like we’re talking just a few hundred or thousand potential individuals.

The (6) distinct types of Class III NFA weapons are …

1) Machineguns – Often referred to as full-autos, automatics, etc… any firearm which fires more than 1 bullet for each individual pull of the trigger.

2) Short Barreled Rifles (SBR) – Rifles with barrels less than 16″.
3) Short Barreled Shotguns (SBS) – Shotguns with barrels less than 18”.
4) Silencers (Suppressors). Silencers/Suppressors are never portrayed accurately in the movies. If the bullet speed breaks the sound barrier, you WILL hear a pop. Suppressors are meant to alter the signature of a weapon so that it sounds like something else and/or the sound heard doesn’t mark the shooter’s position as easily as a non-suppressed weapon. .22 cal firearms can be suppressed very well though. You can make them so quiet that the action cycling produces more sound than the fired bullet does. With other calibers, sub sonic ammo can be used to lessen the signature as the bullet leaves the barrel. Best analogy I can give is a normal suppressed 5.56/223 from an AR15 will sound more like a .22 cal. rifle being fired.

5) Any Other Weapon (AOW) – these are usually things that don’t meet the other criteria above. Put a fore grip on a pistol, guess what? You JUST made an AOW weapon and if the proper paperwork and approval were not obtained prior, you have violated NFA regulations and possess a contraband weapon that carries severe fines and penalties. Other common AOW classifications are these wallet holsters you see that are meant to be/could be fired while the weapon is still in the holster. Pen guns are another example.

AOWs are a little special in that the transfer tax for them is only $5.00. Ironically, the “maker” of the AOW still has to pay a $200 maker Form 1 fee just like he/she would to make a SBR, SBS or Silencer.

6) Destructive Devices (DDs) – these are self explanatory, but the ATF has classified several classes of shotguns now as destructive devices. The infamous ‘Street Sweeper’ shotgun is considered a DD by the ATF and falls into the title 2/NFA realm.

The ATF forms usually used in dealing with these weapons are …

1) ATF Form 1 – Maker Form – used by non manufactures to make NFA weapons – for civilians, only Short Barrel Rifles, Short Barreled Shotguns, Silencers and AOWs can still be made (after May 1986). The ‘one time’ tax stamp for this form is $200. Maker will received an approved form back from ATF and he/she can then make the item in question. Once made, if transfer of ownership is ever needed, this would be facilitated on a Form 4 below.

2) ATF Form 2 – Manufacturer Registration Form – used by manufacturers only.

3) ATF Form 3 – Dealer to Dealer tax-free form. Any SOT can transfer to any other SOT tax free NFA weapons he/she has in their possession/ownership. This is usually done when someone buys an item and it is transferred from a dealer in one state to a dealer in the buyer’s state to facilitate the approval/filing process.

4) ATF Form 4 – Tax paid to/from individual form – used when a NFA item is transferred TO or FROM an individual. Even if the individual transfers the said item to a SOT holder/dealer, there still is a $200 transfer tax. Once the SOT has it, they can transfer it back out to another SOT holder tax free (Form 3) or directly to another individual in their state on a tax paid (Form 4).

5) ATF Form 5 – Used to transfer NFA items to police departments for official use – tax fee transfer. Dealer use only.

6) ATF Form 5320 – Used in the Interstate Transportation of all Title II firearms. If you are traveling between states, you WILL need to fill this form out a few weeks in advance.
NFA weapons must remain in the possession of the registered owner so short of just a few exceptions; you may not permit anyone to have possession of your weapon without you being in immediate presence.

Here at Old Glory Guns & Ammo NH, we can make your NFA Class III weapons purchase painless! It’s easier than buying a car. We will walk you through the process, and assist in filling out the forms properly the first time, so there is no ‘back and forth’ with the BATF. If you have any questions on the process, or are unsure of what you need to get the process started, call us and one of our knowledgeable sales staff will help you!


NFA Class III - Old Glory Guns & Ammo

DANG! You can get so long winded that you could run all the windmills in West Texas by yourself.

 

[OkieStubble]

You cannot legally own an actual M4 in the US unless you are a licensed dealer and/or manufacturer of Title 2 firearms. Any full auto Title 2 firearm manufactured after May of 1986 can only be lawfully owned by the above, military, or law enforcement. IIRC, the M4 wasn't introduced until the 1990's, so it would be impossible for a normal citizen to legally own one. You could buy a lower receiver registered prior to May 1986 and put M4 parts on it, but that is the only option. I would recommend forming a Revocable Living Trust(talk to an estate attorney) if you choose to do this...it removes a number of hassles for you and any potential inheritors.

I am going to play this word semantics game with you and say again, yes, you can own an actual M4. I will break down my reasoning again as to why and how. The Military version of the M4 that is produced at the Colt military side of production and is the exact same place where the LE version of the M4 is produced which LE and Civilians can own. The ONLY DIFFERENCES, between these two rifles is ONLY the SELECT FIRE SWITCH and the AUTO SEAR. Which allows one to fire in 3 shot burst and full auto and the other only semi-auto. Everything else, and I do mean EVERYTHING! is exactly the same. The steel is the same, the chrome barrel is the same, the parkerizing is the same. The M4 roll mark is the same, The military quality and reliability is the same.

If you want to argue the word semantic and suggest that the only true definition of the roll mark "M4" is designated for the full auto rifle, then your argument and debate is with Colt. Because Colt differs with you, by putting the "M4" roll mark on both rifles. So apparently, the only one who thinks the semi version isn't an M4, is you.


Still friends?