Best of the ‘Common’ vintage straights

[Dzaw]

So, there are some names I see a lot more than others. I am sure there are probably a couple of thousand grinders who would pop up in any attempt at cataloguing vintage razor grinders, the history is so darned long, and there were so many places making and exporting razors, etc.

Nonetheless, I see a lot of discussion and inventory of some much more often. Henkels, puma, dubl duck, ERN, Filarmonica, etc. the more common vintage straights.

Of the more common razors, is there a notable quality difference? I am not -only- talking about the steel (though hardness, edge retention, ease of honing, etc, are all very important) but also about things like the care with which scales were fit up, wedged, blade centered, pins and fittings applied and peened, scale material, etc. etc. etc.

For example, I passed on a vintage 4/8 with a heavy grind the other day. It was in superb shape, very clean, no pitting, and the little bit of rust was not near the pivot nor the bevel. I was quite intrigued, but the tip kept hitting the wedge on its way by, both opening and closing. That struck me as distinctly sub optimal, and either a sign that it had been inexpertly re scales, or poorly designed to begin with.

With so many choices, are some just plain better than others? Is there a guide or way to tell? Do I have to become a historian of razor lore or take a crapshoot with unknown small makers and hope they’re one of the good ones?

 

[Lightcs1776]

I have a couple Geneva, NY razors that are great shavers. While I would love a double duck, there are many lesser known razors that perform extremely well.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[global_dev]

Of the more common razors, is there a notable quality difference? I am not -only- talking about the steel (though hardness, edge retention, ease of honing, etc, are all very important) but also about things like the care with which scales were fit up, wedged, blade centered, pins and fittings applied and peened, scale material, etc. etc. etc.

For example, I passed on a vintage 4/8 with a heavy grind the other day. It was in superb shape, very clean, no pitting, and the little bit of rust was not near the pivot nor the bevel. I was quite intrigued, but the tip kept hitting the wedge on its way by, both opening and closing. That struck me as distinctly sub optimal, and either a sign that it had been inexpertly re scales, or poorly designed to begin with.

With so many choices, are some just plain better than others? Is there a guide or way to tell? Do I have to become a historian of razor lore or take a crapshoot with unknown small makers and hope they’re one of the good ones?

There were definitely luxury lines where the materials and presentation where top class versus the basic lines. However I wouldn't be surprised if scales were more or less available amongst most grinders/manufacturers.

a tip hitting a wedge is easily fixed and could also be due to materials shrinking/warping with age but it was probably ok when it was made. I think you'll be okay with any of the vintage blades, as long as the temper is good, the dimensions are ok. It'll be a personal decision if you like a particular regions metal, grind, shape, size, etc.

 

[Twelvefret]

When I was putting my collection together I looked for British, German. 5/8. 6/8, American steel, shoulderless, and of course Ivoroid or ivory color scales.

The brands I wanted were John Holler, Wade and Butcher, J.R. Torrey, razors from Fremont, Ohio, Herder, German exporter M. Jung, pre merger Geneva, and pre 1892 McKinely Tariff Wade and Butcher.

Just some razors for you to consider!!!

 

[6Cuda6]

Its pretty hard not to go with your gut as youve already learned.....for me first and foremost is the look.....it has to catch my eye...them the blade type/size....then the condition....if all is good, including price of course, i buy it. Generally i dont buy chinese razors (gold dollars are probably the exception) and brand doesnt matter as there was lots of cross labeling going on just like today.

I also seek out razors from different countries and try to own at least one from there which makes a collection pretty versatile.....hence not worrying about brands so much.

 

[ajduplessis]

Wade&Butcher, Bismarck, Bengall

 

[Twelvefret]

Putting together your collection is fun.

 

[Dzaw]

Putting together your collection is fun.

It sure is. I was just hoping for some level of “keep an eye out for X, but don’t bother with Y”.

It seems aside from condition issues and size/ grind preferences, there doesn’t seem to be much to recommend certain options over one another.

Well, that should make a bit more of an interesting process. It sure means a lot more antique shop stops

 

[Twelvefret]

It sure is. I was just hoping for some level of “keep an eye out for X, but don’t bother with Y”.

It seems aside from condition issues and size/ grind preferences, there doesn’t seem to be much to recommend certain options over one another.

Well, that should make a bit more of an interesting process. It sure means a lot more antique shop stops

I figure with the demands of the professional barbers most of the razors from the major makers were excellent.

5/8 seems to have been the most popular based on present availability. 6/8 is my favorite next to 5/8.

 

[global_dev]

dont bother with pakistan made “damascus” PWS RSOs. Take caution with OEM chinese current models if you dont have the resources to get them to real ready.

the thing is once someone with a following says that a mark/model is really nice, there is a huge market uptick in them. they probably are nice but not much nicer than any ither vintage in that same style.

some days i like to use extra hollow, some i like near wedges, i tend to like 6/8s and above but will dip into 5/8+s once in a while, but i’ll leave all the 4/8s and below at the table.

but whats good is personal preference.

 

[Legion]

With vintage I’d say condition is usually more important than brand.

 

[seattleshaver]

Since so much of it is personal preference, until you can answer those questions based on your own experience I wouldn't pay too much for any single razor.

If you don't pay too much and if you pay more attention to the condition, eventually you will find out what you prefer and you can resell those you don't care for without losing much money (if any).

I eventually found 6 or 7 that I liked the look of in the sizes that I like. I sold all my others that I learned on. It's also a good idea to learn the basics of repairing and cleaning razors IMO.

As was mentioned above somewhere, it's likely that the razor that you found that wasn't centered correctly was due to the scales warping with age and not upon manufacture.

 

[mawashi]

So, there are some names I see a lot more than others. I am sure there are probably a couple of thousand grinders who would pop up in any attempt at cataloguing vintage razor grinders, the history is so darned long, and there were so many places making and exporting razors, etc.

Nonetheless, I see a lot of discussion and inventory of some much more often. Henkels, puma, dubl duck, ERN, Filarmonica, etc. the more common vintage straights.

Of the more common razors, is there a notable quality difference? I am not -only- talking about the steel (though hardness, edge retention, ease of honing, etc, are all very important) but also about things like the care with which scales were fit up, wedged, blade centered, pins and fittings applied and peened, scale material, etc. etc. etc.

For example, I passed on a vintage 4/8 with a heavy grind the other day. It was in superb shape, very clean, no pitting, and the little bit of rust was not near the pivot nor the bevel. I was quite intrigued, but the tip kept hitting the wedge on its way by, both opening and closing. That struck me as distinctly sub optimal, and either a sign that it had been inexpertly re scales, or poorly designed to begin with.

With so many choices, are some just plain better than others? Is there a guide or way to tell? Do I have to become a historian of razor lore or take a crapshoot with unknown small makers and hope they’re one of the good ones?

It really depends on your budget. I'm more a user than collector so I rather have great shaving blades than fanciful razor... That and I'm a little cheap lol, my razors range between $30-82, cept for a $150 razor that was PIFed to me.

I was told by a reliable source that the old English wedges like a W&B can warp and I experienced one such purchase myself.

The blades that I would consider underrated but excellent: Red Imp, Herder, Bengall, ERN, most singing razors like a those stamped with Hamburg ring.

To me if I had to restart my collection and I wanted a great shaving razor it'll be a 13/16 singing razor from bengall.

 

[kingfisher]

Heljestrand blades are fantastic.

 

[steveclarkus]

If you come across a Bengall, get it!

 

[ajduplessis]

If you come across a Bengall, get it!

Yes, They are exceptional razors

 

[johnb65]

I have a couple of MoDoSo razors and they are far better than you would expect for razors costing £15/20.

 

[Chan Eil Whiskers]

I was thinking of starting a thread titled What are the Superior Vintage Razors?

But, I came across this thread and another recent thread on the Best Shavers (current and vintage), so maybe I don't have to. We'll see.

So far I've gotten a lot of tips on both threads. I certainly don't know anything much about old razors other than what most of us pick up reading and buying stuff on eBay, etc.

This Double Duck Shorty has taken such a great edge off the coticule that I wonder if Double Ducks in general are great razors. This is my only DD. They tend to go high.

I have a Wade which is a favorite (it's currently without scales or I'd be using it).

I know nothing about this brand, Kukri, and this razor cost me only $13.50 on eBay although I've seen some go for much higher prices, but this is a very nice razor. It holds its edge very well. It shaves great. I'd certainly buy another one if I came across one at a good price.

My Pipe Razor seems better than most.

I have a couple of Bokers and like them, but I wouldn't spend extra on another. They're fine but they don't blow me away.

Most of the brands usually mentioned as being extra good tend to fetch extra high prices. Based on my experience with the Double Duck maybe they're worth it. It depends on the condition, and maybe the individual razor, too, of course.

I hope to learn more about this subject myself, a lot more. I have enough razors and am only interested in significant improvements in my collection. I have Americans, and British, and German (only those). None I've purchased have been bad except for one Japanese RSO I shouldn't have purchased.

It's also to a degree about the grind suiting your preferences.

I have in mind maybe acquiring a few more razors, but I want the right ones. I want any additional razors I acquire to be truly Superior Old Razors, but I also know old razors are somewhat of a gamble at best.

Happy shaves,

Jim

 

[SliceOfLife]

Geneva, Genco, Robeson, Clauss are all good brands/labels that don't seem too command any extra value. I'm also a big fan of pretty much everything from the importer/label Koch's (they were a huge barber supply and mail order company... slapped their name on all kinds of razors, usually rebranded Germans and haven't found a bad one).

In general, American made razors have always seemed the best deals for me. Most don't seem to have the fan bases of brands like Puma or W&B, and they seem to avg newer and better condition than a more general avg for vintage blades, as well as tending towards the more practical styles and sizes (not many 9/8" blades or crazy monkey tails or elaborate etchings), making them offer better value as user razors in my opinion.


But problems like you describe will happen. A lot of scales are pressed horn or early plastic which often just doesn't last a century. It was probably never expected it would. Consequently, sometimes the scales bend or the pinning loosens. Also a lot of people rescale because a blade or a pair of scales are broken and they swap two broken razors to make one good one... and often the rescale is imperfect and doesn't close centered. It's usually not a quality issue (the same materials that didn't last a century on a cheap brand don't last a century on an expensive brand either). I guess if you absolutely want scales that definitely never warp, there are a few vintage blades out there with aluminum scales, but due to rarity, they are usually quite expensive. A cheaper alternative is just look for scales in good condition and ask sellers questions about whether the blade ever hits the scales when closing.


DD's are nice razors, but definitely go for a premium... though it has come down. I remember seeing NOS WonderEdges fetch 500-800$ and even slightly worn ones over $300. Now I see good condition ones going for $100-200, and ones that are a little abused are quite attainable.

I think I might have sold you the Kukri... lol. I used to have one with the same scales and spinework, and I did eBay it a couple years ago.

 

[Twelvefret]

When I was putting my collection together I looked for British, German. 5/8. 6/8, American steel, shoulderless, and of course Ivoroid or ivory color scales.

The brands I wanted were John Holler, Wade and Butcher, J.R. Torrey, razors from Fremont, Ohio, Herder, German exporter M. Jung, pre merger Geneva, and pre 1892 McKinely Tariff Wade and Butcher.

Just some razors for you to consider!!!

Report