Black Arkansas "primitive" Happy B-day to me!!!

[Dilbone]

I think that you have gone above and beyond on the effort with that stone and it's just not going to happen for you. It seems to be cursed since you cut it in half and the Xi escaped from it. Novaculite is like that, you know.

Send the lousy rock(s) to me and I will dispose of it properly when I drive through Washita in a couple of weeks.

I might be looking for a place to get rid of the other half...lol

I threatened to a couple buddies that I was gonna bury this damn thing in the back yard and be done with it...

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[rideon66]

I don't have a black Ark, but would be curious about trying Mikawa shiro nagura specifically botan to help smooth it out. I have used this method on my Charnley Forest stones with good success. So I would still use a heavy blade with the nagura slurry till it got broke in well then switch to razors and even use a nagura progression to use finer particles to help it further. I do realize these are different then CF and usually much harder than one too. So I don't know if it would work on one of these. I also start with a botan toishi just smoothing the stone out at first.

Has anyone else tried this?

 

[eKretz]

I start to wonder if there isn't some technique issue or if you somehow got a bad rock. Maybe try sending it to someone else to try?

 

[Dilbone]

I start to wonder if there isn't some technique issue or if you somehow got a bad rock. Maybe try sending it to someone else to try?

I don't know what it could be. I would hate to think it's me but I suppose it could be. I just think the surface isn't right yet. It definitely isn't like glass on the surface yet as some describe it's supposed to be.
I may give up on it for a while

I got the Naniwa 12000 in last week. I took 2 razors from the coti to a couple of 15-20 lap trials and the nani is giving me a fiiiiiiiiine edge. Sharp and smooth. No complaints at all.

Making me wonder if all the work on the arki is worth a darn on top of the couple hundred laps it'll take once it finally is ready vs the 20-30 on the naniwa.

The arkies may be on their way out

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[duke762]

I've been following this thread for quite a while. I've been down this road with my first attempts to lap my first 8 x3 Norton black. What I believe what you are seeing is the remnants or pits, left by course lapping or cutting at the factory. My stone looked exactly like your after many sore arms and big bucks in wet dry.

At this point I turned to what I know from my job.....Five-Star Diamond Compound
Got me where I wanted to go with repeatable results. Lapped through the pits in no time and on to a perfect reflective haze, Don't give up!

 

[Dilbone]

I've been following this thread for quite a while. I've been down this road with my first attempts to lap my first 8 x3 Norton black. What I believe what you are seeing is the remnants or pits, left by course lapping or cutting at the factory. My stone looked exactly like your after many sore arms and big bucks in wet dry.

At this point I turned to what I know from my job.....Five-Star Diamond Compound
Got me where I wanted to go with repeatable results. Lapped through the pits in no time and on to a perfect reflective haze, Don't give up!

Thanks Duke762, I'll have to keep this in mind whenever I decide to pick it back up and make another go of it.

I have been enjoying the Naniwa so far.

I have noticed that the Naniwa gives me a nice bump in sharpness after the coti
I've been shaving the past couple of weeks right off the 12000 and it has been very nice, but it still didn't seem quite as light saber sharp as I'd like.
I decided to hit it with some crox on cotton, like 20 laps after doing 15 on the nani. I could tell when popping hairs on my forearm it was at a different level than before the crox.

The sharpness was definitely bumped up a notch after the crox.

I may have to do a comparison between coming off the coti to crox vs. coming off the nani 12000 to crox. I'm guessing that I may not notice much if any difference at all. If I don't notice a difference then the nani really was waste of a purchase.

Either way, the shave I just got was top notch. Nearly BBS with only what I would call a 1.5pass shave.
I've read so much about guys turning their noses up at someone that uses crox as a final step of their honing process and I've had myself convinced that I shouldn't "need" to use it. Maybe that's true...maybe I shouldn't need it, but right now it gives my blades a nice bump coming off the stones and a much nicer shave. I can't argue with my face on this one. I'm keeping the crox.

 

[Dilbone]

Well, either my face is as fickle as a pre-teen girl or I've gone too far with the nani 12k.

My shaves had been progressively getting worse everyday with the edge off that stone. I would hit it with the crox and it would feel better for a day maybe then back to irritating my skin.

I thought maybe I was losing the edge so I hit it with a few more laps on the nani and the last few days it was unbearable razor burn. I did an A B comparison with a razor honed off my coti and crox and the shave on the coti half of my face was much nicer than the other.

Last night I decided to hit the coti with this razor and see how it felt. I did about 100 laps very light and stropped with linen followed by leather, no crox, and the shave this morning was fantastic and smooth. It wasn't as sharp, but it was so much smoother there is no comparison to the level of comfort.

Oh well....I guess maybe the nani doesn't agree with my face afterall. I'm not sure if I'll sell it quite yet but to finish on the coti is what's working. If I could only get the black arki where it needs to be....now I'm looking at Jnats too....How did I get here?

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[paintflinger]

Well, either my face is as fickle as a pre-teen girl or I've gone too far with the nani 12k.

My shaves had been progressively getting worse everyday with the edge off that stone. I would hit it with the crox and it would feel better for a day maybe then back to irritating my skin.

I thought maybe I was losing the edge so I hit it with a few more laps on the nani and the last few days it was unbearable razor burn. I did an A B comparison with a razor honed off my coti and crox and the shave on the coti half of my face was much nicer than the other.

Last night I decided to hit the coti with this razor and see how it felt. I did about 100 laps very light and stropped with linen followed by leather, no crox, and the shave this morning was fantastic and smooth. It wasn't as sharp, but it was so much smoother there is no comparison to the level of comfort.

Oh well....I guess maybe the nani doesn't agree with my face afterall. I'm not sure if I'll sell it quite yet but to finish on the coti is what's working. If I could only get the black arki where it needs to be....now I'm looking at Jnats too....How did I get here?

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What kind of soap/lather do you use?

 

[skimonster]

Well, either my face is as fickle as a pre-teen girl or I've gone too far with the nani 12k.

My shaves had been progressively getting worse everyday with the edge off that stone. I would hit it with the crox and it would feel better for a day maybe then back to irritating my skin.

I thought maybe I was losing the edge so I hit it with a few more laps on the nani and the last few days it was unbearable razor burn. I did an A B comparison with a razor honed off my coti and crox and the shave on the coti half of my face was much nicer than the other.

Last night I decided to hit the coti with this razor and see how it felt. I did about 100 laps very light and stropped with linen followed by leather, no crox, and the shave this morning was fantastic and smooth. It wasn't as sharp, but it was so much smoother there is no comparison to the level of comfort.

Oh well....I guess maybe the nani doesn't agree with my face afterall. I'm not sure if I'll sell it quite yet but to finish on the coti is what's working. If I could only get the black arki where it needs to be....now I'm looking at Jnats too....How did I get here?

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I think everyone has to find their particular shaving nirvana, as there are so many options available. I'm glad that out of the box, I was introduced to the coticule edge, and have never really felt the need to start searching for something else. Granted, it is not the sharpest edge out there, but am able to get BBS shaves, with no irritation, or discomfort.

 

[Dilbone]

What kind of soap/lather do you use?

I use my own soap exclusively. The closest thing I can compare it to is Tabac. Very rich and thick lather and a pretty thirsty soap so it's imperative to get enough water in it to really get it where you need it with a straight.

 

[Dilbone]

I think everyone has to find their particular shaving nirvana, as there are so many options available. I'm glad that out of the box, I was introduced to the coticule edge, and have never really felt the need to start searching for something else. Granted, it is not the sharpest edge out there, but am able to get BBS shaves, with no irritation, or discomfort.

I'm not sure there's a nirvana exactly, but I totally agree that there are just certain things that work better for certain folks. Right now I just keep going back to the coti. My first experience with it left me feeling like it just isn't keen enough for me...but the more I experiment with other options while still improving my coti edges I just can't get away from the darn coti.

 

[Brianskeet]

Well, either my face is as fickle as a pre-teen girl or I've gone too far with the nani 12k.

My shaves had been progressively getting worse everyday with the edge off that stone. I would hit it with the crox and it would feel better for a day maybe then back to irritating my skin.

I thought maybe I was losing the edge so I hit it with a few more laps on the nani and the last few days it was unbearable razor burn. I did an A B comparison with a razor honed off my coti and crox and the shave on the coti half of my face was much nicer than the other.

Last night I decided to hit the coti with this razor and see how it felt. I did about 100 laps very light and stropped with linen followed by leather, no crox, and the shave this morning was fantastic and smooth. It wasn't as sharp, but it was so much smoother there is no comparison to the level of comfort.

Oh well....I guess maybe the nani doesn't agree with my face afterall. I'm not sure if I'll sell it quite yet but to finish on the coti is what's working. If I could only get the black arki where it needs to be....now I'm looking at Jnats too....How did I get here?

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It is entirely possible that you are about to find yourself in the same place as I am. I get all kinds of giggles for saying this, but here goes: I do not like edges that are "too sharp". I can bring an edge to HHT 5 any time I want to, but I have discovered I don't want to! I think everybody's face has a sweet spot. For my face that is a good coti edge. Depending on the day and my mood that will be HHT 3+ to 4.

 

[Earcutter]

Either way, the shave I just got was top notch. Nearly BBS with only what I would call a 1.5pass shave.
I've read so much about guys turning their noses up at someone that uses crox as a final step of their honing process and I've had myself convinced that I shouldn't "need" to use it. Maybe that's true...maybe I shouldn't need it, but right now it gives my blades a nice bump coming off the stones and a much nicer shave. I can't argue with my face on this one. I'm keeping the crox.

Wow, I don't know what kind of man would say not to hit up some green if it works for you. Personally speaking, I'm a bit of a paste whore now. I wasn't always, but it's just so easy!! So why not? I use the Dovo pastes, diamond pastes and good old crox. The Crox is good and a mainstay. That Dovo stuff makes for a remarkably smooth shave for me. Not the sharpest though, and a bit messy. The diamond on the other hand... well after going at it with the diamond, the hairs pop off before the blade even hits, but it can leave me a little raw. Either way, a little paste can keep a blade off the stones for a LONG time. So why not?

As for the black ark - I get it. I love mine but rarely use it. It'll do work on my kitchen and pocket knives for as long as I live. I figure it'll be really ready for my straights here in about ten more years lol!

 

[David]

It is entirely possible that you are about to find yourself in the same place as I am. I get all kinds of giggles for saying this, but here goes: I do not like edges that are "too sharp". I can bring an edge to HHT 5 any time I want to, but I have discovered I don't want to! I think everybody's face has a sweet spot. For my face that is a good coti edge. Depending on the day and my mood that will be HHT 3+ to 4.

Brian! Good to hear from you!

 

[Brianskeet]

Brian! Good to hear from you!

Thank you! I don't have the time I used to, but wanted to look around and see what folks were doing.

 

[C FrankC]

Brian:
Great to see you back!
I've been fussing with arkies a bit lately and just scored a really nice Vossgiene, matches my smaller one and the two work fine together. Fast on slurry and very fine on water.
I'm constantly trying to perfect the HHT5 smooth shave.
Got close using the Vos pair this morning on a J.A.Henckles 401, best edge on this razor so far.

Frank

 

[Brianskeet]

Brian:
Great to see you back!
I've been fussing with arkies a bit lately and just scored a really nice Vossgiene, matches my smaller one and the two work fine together. Fast on slurry and very fine on water.
I'm constantly trying to perfect the HHT5 smooth shave.
Got close using the Vos pair this morning on a J.A.Henckles 401, best edge on this razor so far.

Frank

Thank you! Life is starting to become a teensy bit more normal again. Hopefully I can check in a bit more often. If I skip a couple days HHT5 feels wonderful, but by day three of every day shaving my face is over it and I am running back to a gentle coti edge.

 

[DaddyD]

Love Ark edges. Here is mine after finishing for straight razors. I use Williams Mug Soap and water. Lovely edges!

 

[Chan Eil Whiskers]

Thanks for the input. I had thought about using some of my film and going all the way to 3u, but decided to just hit it with the chisels per David's advice. I grew weary with that though after a while.



Cool, after what I experienced with a test shave this morning I am leaning your direction on this.




So after I posted last night I decided to take another couple hundred laps on it. I then did some laps on cotton, linen, and leather. The HHT wasn't where it normally is coming off the coticule as I float the blade over arm or leg hair, so I decided I would take a swipe in the morning down my right cheek and see how bad it was. I had another razor stropped and ready also knowing I'd be trading out after a short couple of strokes.

I was pleasantly surprised by the shave. Like very surprised. The ATG on my neck and under my chin was not quite where I'd like it in terms of sharpness but overall it was VERY smooth. I will be hitting this again with another 300-500 laps and see how much more improvement I get. I do think the stone is progressing well and the polish on the blade is beginning to show again.

One question though, I've been using mineral oil so far. I don't mind it, but is there anything anyone would recommend I try that they feel is better?

If you're talking about just for the Ark...



Link to discussion. I like this stuff on my Ark, but read the thread as this product may or may not be good for the stone. I haven't used it enough to know about the stone's long term health, but the edges I'm getting are very good.

I think WD-40 might be good, but haven't tried it without any added mineral oil (I think mineral oil too thick).

Happy shaves,

Jim

 

[Dilbone]

I've used straight WD-40 with razors and knives and I've used 3 in 1 with knives but not with razors. I've also diluted mineral oil with WD-40 which is better than either WD or mineral straight. After finishing on my coti with baby oil the other day I think I'll be trying that on my black and see what happens.