So I ordered the Roedter 1909

[mjclark]

So what I thought was my gold Roedter arrived:

A very nice shave with that Kai blade - but it felt very different with this gold razor, smoother and I couldn't feel any blade flex at all unlike my previous Roedter 1909 shaves:

Closer examination reveals that the top cap on this one is significantly wider - maybe I have been sent a normal FaTip by mistake.
The extra 1mm cap width has made all the difference in the world to the feel of the shave...

... And it's very interesting to compare the normal FaTip shave to the Roedter 1909.

 

[mjclark]

So I got a reply from Scharferladen about the wider cap on the Gold Roedter.

It turns out that the Gold, Titanium and Chrome Roedter 1909s were all bought in a single batch some years ago.
The Gold caps are wider than the Titanium and Chrome caps which adds weight to the theory that this was just a big production error.

The Gold caps are still narrower than the standard FaTips and it's a VERY VERY aggressive shave but better behaved and with better ATG performance - the fabled Roedter v2!

Has anybody got a standard FaTip to measure the width of the standard cap for comparison?

 

[mjclark]

Looking at other threads about FaTip caps I wonder if the Roedter caps were an intermediate design - the old FaTip caps were narrow like the Roedter but more curved, the newer FaTip caps are wider but shallow like the Roedter.

So the Roedter cap has the narrowness of the Old cap with the shallowness of the new cap.
The Gold Roedter v2 is slightly wider but retains the shallowness...

 

[creekwalker]

That's very interesting. You inspired me to get a gold Roedter--but it seems that der Scharfer Laden's supply is kaput. (I searched every which way, but only the chrome and titanium showed.) I did, however, foolishly order a titanium...

 

[mjclark]

That's very interesting. You inspired me to get a gold Roedter--but it seems that der Scharfer Laden's supply is kaput. (I searched every which way, but only the chrome and titanium showed.) I did, however, foolishly order a titanium...

Congrats on ordering the fierce Titanium Roedter 1909!
It'll be very interesting to hear what you make of it.
With a light touch these are actually great razors although the blade feel can initially be shocking and off putting.

And I wonder why the comparatively tamer gold Roedter v2 has disappeared now. It was a lot closer to an original FaTip.

I'm fascinated by how these Roedter 1909s came to be made and sold.
Obviously they originated with Fazzini/FaTip.

The proprietor of Scharferladen says she bought a big lot of these from a distributor in Premana who no longer exists.
That would have been 2014 when these were first discussed at the Dutch forum shavingsociety.

But it's still unclear as to whether this was a deliberate experiment or just a production error.
And why does the Gold version have a wider cap, or is this just another example of very slack tolerances?

 

[Polarbeard]

So what I thought was my gold Roedter arrived:

Closer examination reveals that the top cap on this one is significantly wider - maybe I have been sent a normal FaTip by mistake.
The extra 1mm cap width has made all the difference in the world to the feel of the shave...
... And it's very interesting to compare the normal FaTip shave to the Roedter 1909.

I've understood that there's a new modified version of the Fatip for sale these days, but the "original" version of the Fatip has a cap that's exactly 18mm wide.

 

[mjclark]

So here's the figures for the Roedter 1909 caps:

All the caps have the flatter height of the newer FaTip caps @ 2.1mm

The Roedter v1 Chrome cap is 17.2mm wide at one end and 18mm wide at the other end.

The Roedter v1 Titanium cap is 18mm wide at both ends.

The Roedter v2 Gold cap is 18.2mm wide at one end and 18.6mm wide at the other.

It would be a good guess that these caps are the product of some very slack manufacturing tolerances.

And it's a happy accident because with a light touch those Roedters are quite amazing, albeit quite shocking, shavers!

Surely these measurements reveal that these were manufacturing accidents but really it's very fortuitous for us.

It would be very interesting to know other people's Roedter and FaTip cap measurements...

 

[Bookworm]

My FaTip (nickel plate) cap is 19.34mm wide at both ends (supposedly V2 because of stamp on underside of base plate)
Maximum thickness of top cap appears to be 1.95-7mm
Height of top cap from top of cap to edge of cap is 4.12-3 mm
Height of comb is 6.42mm
thickness of comb at center is 2.65mm

Does that help at all?

 

[mjclark]

My FaTip (nickel plate) cap is 19.34mm wide at both ends (supposedly V2 because of stamp on underside of base plate)
Maximum thickness of top cap appears to be 1.95-7mm
Height of top cap from top of cap to edge of cap is 4.12-3 mm
Height of comb is 6.42mm
thickness of comb at center is 2.65mm

Does that help at all?

Thanks that's very helpful and certainly shows how much smaller the Roedter cap is than the FaTip.
Would be great to get other measurements from other razors just to see how variable this cap design is....

 

[mjclark]

The boss at Scharferladen, Susann, tells me that there are 50 Gold Roedter 1909s left in stock.
I guess since 2014 these have sold VERY slowly...
...And are on the way to becoming cult collector classics

 

[Kojak]

Second shave with the Roedter 1909 and I must admit that it's starting to feel less like a big mistake and more like a happy accident.
It does have obvious and quite serious issues: blade alignment is appalling (as you'd expect from any FaTip) and there's a lot of blade flex which makes shaving ATG a harsh, bitey and hazardous affair.
And there's just so much blade feel that you know this wasn't a deliberate design.

BUT it has a very wide range of effective angles and, with the lightest of touches, gives a shave completely free of irritation delivering a shocking marble-like BBS++

For the first shave I'd used a thick cream with a lot of cushion because that seemed like common sense given that there was so much blade exposure.

For this second shave however I used a very slick watery lather as I do with straights, and got a much better shave so obviously a slick prep is required to get the best from the Roedter 1909.
I'm off to work now with a face that feels like an ice rink
View attachment 760910

Hi Marcus! Was very interested in a Roedter 1909 & came across your adventure with this razor in the forum section. Just would like to ask if you still use it and whats your current opinion on the Roedter 1909. I notice alot of negative opinion across the board,but I enjoy a aggressive shave. How would you compare this to an Ikon Tech?Thanks

 

[mjclark]

Hi Marcus! Was very interested in a Roedter 1909 & came across your adventure with this razor in the forum section. Just would like to ask if you still use it and whats your current opinion on the Roedter 1909. I notice alot of negative opinion across the board,but I enjoy a aggressive shave. How would you compare this to an Ikon Tech?Thanks

Having now I acquired a PAA DOC Evo I can tell you that the Roedter 1909 gives a very similar shave.
It has much more tendency to bite than the Shavecraft Tech and is even more manouverable.
It's like a Devette with a guard so the geometry is quite crude - you need a very very light touch but the result is phenomenal.

The PAA DOC Evo costs $175 and is a stainless steel work of art.
The Roedter 1909 is a $30 brass FaTip with a manufacturing error hence the general low opinion of it.
It's similar to the way that you can get a similar shave from a $8 Gold Dollar straight to a $200 1880's Wade and Butcher.

Stuff like that really pushes people's buttons

 

[mjclark]

Inspired by @Kojak I broke out the chrome Roedter tonight which is the most most aggressive of the 3 that I have.
What an astonishingly good shave - about as near perfect as a DE shave can get.
Very manouverable, literally no irritation and an immaculate guaranteed BBS:

 

[creekwalker]

Marcus, I believe you said that your gold Roedter was the (comparably) mildest one, so I ordered one of those to go along with the gunmetal version, already shipped. Looking at both of them after they arrived, it was indeed obvious that one had much more blade exposure than the other--but in my case the gunmetal was the mildest and the gold razor was the monster!

I have shaved only with the gold model (twice). The first time was...interesting...it did indeed have an almost awful amount of blade feel. The shave was close, but surprisingly not quite as close even as with my MK1 Fatip, let alone my Spitfire (or my stock 2011) R41s. But the second time I really enjoyed the shave, simply because it was nice to be able to get away with using a razor that's so severe feeling (there did not happen to be any nicks either time). I believe that shaving with it occasionally should insure that my perspective remains pleasantly "warped" in favor of aggressiveness; it should eliminate any danger of complacency.

 

[mjclark]

@creekwalker what are the widths of your Roedter caps?

Sounds like it's a lucky dip!
Man what a razor!!

 

[creekwalker]

@creekwalker what are the widths of your Roedter caps?

Sounds like it's a lucky dip!
Man what a razor!!

I don't have a caliper, and my spatial sense isn't good, but each cap seems to relate to the 18mm mark this way:
the gunmetal cap just barely covers it
the gold cap just barely lets me still see it

 

[mjclark]

I don't have a caliper, and my spatial sense isn't good, but each cap seems to relate to the 18mm mark this way:
the gunmetal cap just barely covers it
the gold cap just barely lets me still see it

Thanks - I guess the Gold is consistently the mildest and best behaved and shaves nearest to a FaTip...

 

[creekwalker]

Thanks - I guess the Gold is consistently the mildest and best behaved and shaves nearest to a FaTip...

Your gold, I assume you mean? (And not the gold ones generally)

 

[mjclark]

@creekwalker Yes - your gold is wider than your Titanium too though?

My titanium is the only one where the edges of the cap are truly parallel and it's the same width all all along.

I suppose this means that every single Roedter 1909 is different!!

 

[creekwalker]

@creekwalker Yes - your gold is wider than your Titanium too though?

My titanium is the only one where the edges of the cap are truly parallel and it's the same width all all along.

I suppose this means that every single Roedter 1909 is different!!

Arrrrgh! In post #56 above I reversed them! It's my gunmetal Roedter that just covers the 18mm mark, and the gold one that leaves it visible. As I had noted in an earlier post (correctly that time), it's my gold version that is the monster, and the gunmetal one that has less exposure. My apologies