Gents, I am need of a new machine and even after a few years of pulling shots on a cheapola Lunghi machine I bought for the wife would consider myself rather an amateur at making espresso and her favourite, latte. The title says it best. I am going to be limited to that price range. It is not in the cards for more any time soon. I have a decent grinder and it will provide a good espresso grind but is certainly not professional quality. Where to start? I read a bit of the 'first esrpesso machine' sticky but wonder if there is a new thought or three about machines in this range. Thank you.
Recommend Something In the 500-600-ish Dollar Range?
- Thread starter Phog Allen
- Start date
Hey maybe I can help out. Im not a professional by any means but I have a little experience with some machines. For that price range you're looking mainly at SBDU(single boiler dual use) machines. These machine have one boiler which is set at one temperature for brewing espresso, and the you can flip a switch so that they temperature increases and you can steam milk but you can only do one at a time. The two most recommended ones that I've seen are the Gaggia classic on the low end (around $380) and the Rancilio Silvia for the high end (around 685). Both of these machines use traditional boilers and heating elements. Another class of machine also seen at the entry level uses a thermoblock instead of a tradition boiler. This is what Breville uses in I believe everything but the Dual Boiler and the Oracle.
I have used a Gaggia Classic for a number of years and it does very well but I don't steam a lot of milk. The most I usually have is a Cortado which only calls for around 2oz of milk. Any more than that and the machine loses a lot of steam power because the boiler is very small. I believe its around 3oz. Since you say that your wife likes lattes, the Rancilio silvia may be a little better because its boiler is 12oz which it holds much more steam. Also in order to get the Gaggia to make better quality steam, I needed to install the steam wand from and old Silvia, It is a great machine but does have its downfalls. The Rancilio also seems a little more future proof because you can add a PID if you would like which should increase the temperature stability down the road if you wanted too.
Personally I would look very hard at the Rancilio and see if its something you might like. There are reviews of it everywhere and since they just recently released a new updated model, the Silvia M or V5, you might be able to pick up and open box V4 on eBay or another source for a little cheaper. It has also been around for a very long time and looks like a very durable option.
I also have a Breville BES820 which uses a thermoblock. Honestly the steam on this machine cannot compare to my Gaggia which already isn't super strong which is why I wouldn't recommend any Breville models other than maybe a Dual Boiler which is a more traditional set up. They are however more expensive at I think around $1000-1200 but have more features than both of the previous machines along with the ability to steam milf and brew espresso at the same time. My breville also has a solid build and is very user friendly.
Lastly there is a new kid on the block called Decent Espresso. I don't think they have officially started production but they seem to be doing some interesting things for right around $1000 if you wanted to look into that as well.
If you have any more questions just throw em out there and Ill help out the best that I can.
I have used a Gaggia Classic for a number of years and it does very well but I don't steam a lot of milk. The most I usually have is a Cortado which only calls for around 2oz of milk. Any more than that and the machine loses a lot of steam power because the boiler is very small. I believe its around 3oz. Since you say that your wife likes lattes, the Rancilio silvia may be a little better because its boiler is 12oz which it holds much more steam. Also in order to get the Gaggia to make better quality steam, I needed to install the steam wand from and old Silvia, It is a great machine but does have its downfalls. The Rancilio also seems a little more future proof because you can add a PID if you would like which should increase the temperature stability down the road if you wanted too.
Personally I would look very hard at the Rancilio and see if its something you might like. There are reviews of it everywhere and since they just recently released a new updated model, the Silvia M or V5, you might be able to pick up and open box V4 on eBay or another source for a little cheaper. It has also been around for a very long time and looks like a very durable option.
I also have a Breville BES820 which uses a thermoblock. Honestly the steam on this machine cannot compare to my Gaggia which already isn't super strong which is why I wouldn't recommend any Breville models other than maybe a Dual Boiler which is a more traditional set up. They are however more expensive at I think around $1000-1200 but have more features than both of the previous machines along with the ability to steam milf and brew espresso at the same time. My breville also has a solid build and is very user friendly.
Lastly there is a new kid on the block called Decent Espresso. I don't think they have officially started production but they seem to be doing some interesting things for right around $1000 if you wanted to look into that as well.
If you have any more questions just throw em out there and Ill help out the best that I can.
- Thread starter
- #3
Hi Anthony. Thank you for the great feedback. I knew there was a lot of compromise to be made in this price range. Like no dual boiler setup. I suppose for me the durability and longevity aspect is an issue to be reckoned. Typically the machine would be used to make one latte in the morning and possibly two or three on certain weekends. So you can see why I a big budget setup is not a good value for us.
Do you have your heart set on a NEW machine?
- Thread starter
- #5
Tutle, no, a used machine is alright but I would have to see it and know the seller. This type of appliance is somewhat notorious for mechanical issues.
This suggestion is not for everyone, but you could consider the non-electric Rok (presso) espresso maker and have plenty of budget left over to splurge on an electric milk frother/warmer if you wanted that functionality or convenience. If your current grinder is stepless or has many fine steps you may be fine, otherwise you may also want to hedge some funds for a potentially buying a new grinder in the future regardless of your choice of espresso machine.
I have looked at used machines as well but the problem is that for that price range there are still limitations but at least to start off those machines new are the best ones that I can think of. Stepping up from a single boiler to a heat exchange or even a dual boiler is a nice step up, one that I am actually contemplating myself, but the cost increases as well. If you are willing to buy used, I have seen some Breville Dual Boilers BES920 which is the newer model and the BES900, older model on eBay. Ive read that the older model cannot be descaled without being send into Brevile for maintenance but I'm not sure how true that is. You can also keep an eye out on some espresso forums if you don't mind waiting and you may be able to find a used heat exchanger for sale.
Also what type of grinder are you currently using since that can make a great deal of difference as well.
Also what type of grinder are you currently using since that can make a great deal of difference as well.
What is it? The grinder is really more important than the machine and many tend to leave it as an afterthought.
I have had a Breville BES840 "The Infuser" for about 3 years now with no issues. Pulls a great shot of espresso through the single walled basket. Enough pressure to quickly and easily steam enough milk for 3 x lattes in a 1 L SS jug. Does't have the dreaded "froth enhancer" that you get on the steam wand of cheaper machines and gets great micro foam. Paired it with a Breville BCG800 "smart grinder". Some nice little design feature like auto clean, magnet on the tamper to slot back into place when you've finished with it.
Also curious as to what is your grinder? I'd strongly suggest looking at used machines. You can find great deals with some patience. Most of the best machines are actually quite easy to repair if anything goes wrong, and you should know how to do your own maintenance anyway.
- Thread starter
- #11
Gents, the grinder is a rebadged Baratza 1MP1SP. They were sold and closed out by Starbucks. They ran about $160 new. They have an adjustment for fine grinding and I think I have it sorted for good espresso grind but would never make the assumption with my limited experience.
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't that Starbucks Baratza similar [same?] as the Encore?
How about something simple and classic. They are not overly difficult to restore and easy to use and not as fussy about the grind like most other machines.
I enjoy restoring these older 50/60's Italian espresso machines. The Vam \ Caravel Arrarex. Occasionally I sell but end up finding and restoring again. Recently sold a nice 1.3 ver. Only to replace with this 1.0 ver. Here is my latest find, liking the yellow.
Shown here drying during some assembly after a 24 hrs O2/detergent and mild brushing. I replaced all the gaskets including the portafileter seal. I also upgrade some of the internal wiring to new high temp. Should last another 50 years.
Secret is to add boiling water to kettle to expedite time to desired temp. These are not high power machines. The water sits in a kettle above the burner and never makes contact with it. They make for a wonderful clean cup of espresso. On a side note I'm in the process of getting some pricing on having some bottomless portafilters and tampers made.
I enjoy restoring these older 50/60's Italian espresso machines. The Vam \ Caravel Arrarex. Occasionally I sell but end up finding and restoring again. Recently sold a nice 1.3 ver. Only to replace with this 1.0 ver. Here is my latest find, liking the yellow.
Shown here drying during some assembly after a 24 hrs O2/detergent and mild brushing. I replaced all the gaskets including the portafileter seal. I also upgrade some of the internal wiring to new high temp. Should last another 50 years.
Secret is to add boiling water to kettle to expedite time to desired temp. These are not high power machines. The water sits in a kettle above the burner and never makes contact with it. They make for a wonderful clean cup of espresso. On a side note I'm in the process of getting some pricing on having some bottomless portafilters and tampers made.
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Thanks a lot!
Slash McCoy
I freehand dog rockets
If the $600 price is not a non-starter for you, then I might recommend what I am using, a DeLonghi Magnifica superauto. I like cappuccino and it steams milk pretty good. Very convenient. It has a pretty decent grinder but you got to keep people from dumping flavored beans in it because it will gum up on flavored beans. there is a place for introducing GROUND flavored coffee if you go in for that stuff. Had mine for 3 years now with no probs yet. There are superautos with milk tanks that are even more convenient for cappa or latte, but I prefer an external wand, and at any rate those machines are a bit pricey for me.
I froth a little more than 4oz I guess, for my usual, and then pull two double shots. and fill a 12oz cup. It handles that much milk with no problem.
I froth a little more than 4oz I guess, for my usual, and then pull two double shots. and fill a 12oz cup. It handles that much milk with no problem.
Slash McCoy
I freehand dog rockets
http://www.brevilleusa.com/the-barista-expresstm.html looks interesting, too. NOT a superautomatic, which might or might not be what you want anyway. It does have its own burr grinder, though.
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