Hand Sanding Questions

[ccpastork]

I have come to a stopping point on my first attempt at a restoration and thought it best to ask some questions. I should have asked these questions beforehand.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/509950-Dipping-My-Toe-In?p=8753653#post8753653

1. When hand sanding do you sand in only one direction?
2. What is the progression of grits most of you use?
3. Do you start with dry sanding and then end each grit progression with wet sanding?
4. What do you use to hold the sandpaper? I have tried wood a dowel, but that makes for sore fingers.
5. What do you use to hold the razor? I put it on damp newspaper, however, this is not very effective.

I am not interested in doing a bunch of razors, just an occasional fun project.

 

[edwinhmcbride]

I try to sand in one direction.

Smaller grit jumps give better results.

I always wet sand but 3in1 oil or wd40 and it prolongs the grit on the paper and gives a much better finish especially with fine grits.

I fold the paper over a tounge depressor. Helps keep the edges sharp and helps with my arthritis.

I just rap the blade with a rag.

 

[Slash McCoy]

I change directions slightly between grits, if a lot of steel will be coming off. Changing directions helps you to see when the previous grits scratches are completely gone. I start with whatever grit the job calls for. I have started with 1k grit, and I have started with 60 grit. Depends on how bad the damage and how much steel I can afford to lose. For a Gold Dollar I always do a LOT of thinning and shaping with sandpaper. For a fine vintage I will often leave some pitting rather than excessively thin the razor with too much sanding. I usually hold the razor in hand. I make various wooden forms for sanding blocks, and use different size hose as well. Air hose, fuel hose, garden hose... all has different properties. I also have a couple of forms I made that accept 1/3 sheet of sandpaper on each side that I push/pull the razor in, and this works great for thinning and shaping a GD66. The last few razors I posted on this forum were done that way. I made the jigs with a 3d printer.

One way to make a wooden sanding block for a hollowground razor is to use the razor covered with 60 grit as the sanding block to shape the wood. You can then glue some rubber onto the wood to give it some resilience and help keep it from sliding on the sandpaper.

Often I will fold a bit of sandpaper over the spine, pinch it between thumb and forefinger, and push/pull the razor between the sandpaper with my sanding hand ALWAYS across the spine, never the edge. A dull razor can still send you to the emergency room when you are bearing down with pressure and rapidly moving it between tightly pinched fingers and sandpaper.

 

[mycarver]

Now to confuse the issue ( sorry edwinmcbride)

i will vary the direction especially with finer grits. It let's you read the progress better.

naturally follow grit progressions .

I never wet sand

Ill never back the paper with a hard form such as a
piece of wood . Sandpaper doesn't work as well this way.

i never wrap the blade for any reason nor use one of the popular " jigs" for holding blades while sanding.

 

[ccpastork]

Though there is some difference of opinion, you have confirmed that that I have been doing some things right and I now have a better idea on how to proceed. Thank you gentleman for you input and sharing you knowledge.

 

[mycarver]

You also said the tail was bent? How so ? I wasn't able to make it out from the picture. Usually that's something that has to be measured though on some you can sight it visually down the spine and thru the tail.

 

[ccpastork]

@mycarver I can see it by sighting down the spine as well as when the razor is laying flat on each side. On one side the tail touches the flat surface and laying on the other side it is raised off of the surface. If may actually be bent at the tang?



So frustrating when it rotates the image.

 

[Slash McCoy]

I see a lot of warped monkeytails. It really isn't much of an issue. Even further up on the tang, it is often better to just live with a slight bend than get medieval about fixing it.

 

[mycarver]

Yup . More common than you might think. It may be how it's ground or I also tend to think the stamping process has something to do with it as most seem to "bend" in the very same way this one is showing .
It can cause centering issues .

 

[ccpastork]

Yup . More common than you might think. It may be how it's ground or I also tend to think the stamping process has something to do with it as most seem to "bend" in the very same way this one is showing .
It can cause centering issues .

The important question: is this a flaw I can easily work around or would it be better to cease the project? I assume it cannot be straightened.

 

[ccpastork]

I see a lot of warped monkeytails. It really isn't much of an issue. Even further up on the tang, it is often better to just live with a slight bend than get medieval about fixing it.

Somehow I missed seeing your reply...is it difficult to overcome the centering issue mentioned by mycarver?

 

[Slash McCoy]

Somehow I missed seeing your reply...is it difficult to overcome the centering issue mentioned by mycarver?

Depends on how bad it is. I can usually fix centering problems by sanding the inner face of the scales to steer the blade in the direction it needs to go. Some guys use washers which I do not like as it does not correct the actual angle, just scoots the blade over and also makes the pivot wider and reduces the natural friction of scales on steel, giving the razor a sloppy floppy feel. YMMV but I prefer sanding. There are two distinct regions to sand... The part toward the scale end from the pivot hole, and the area toward the body from the pivot hole. To guide the blade toward the show side scale, the region toward the body of the show side scale gets sanded, and the region toward the tip of the back side scale is sanded. Vice versa to steer it toward the back side scale. When the pin is peened the blade then centers, assuming the proper amount of material removal. You could also build up the opposite side with a smear of epoxy but I have never done that.

 

[mycarver]

The important question: is this a flaw I can easily work around or would it be better to cease the project? I assume it cannot be straightened.

There are ways to straighten them to some extent though it poses some possible problems .
there are probably millions out there like this one. And this one worked just fine for what,, decades?
just build it. And there are lots of ways to overcome centering issues if it arises.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Oh another thing. Some members have had success in straightening bent tangs using a vise and three pieces of pinning stock. The problem with straightening a blade is the hardened steel easily shatters and does not readily bend. Using the pins and vise method gives a very controlled bending effort that does not usually break the blade. Whether it is worth risking a valuable or irreplaceable blade or not is your call.

 

[ccpastork]

Depends on how bad it is. I can usually fix centering problems by sanding the inner face of the scales to steer the blade in the direction it needs to go. Some guys use washers which I do not like as it does not correct the actual angle, just scoots the blade over and also makes the pivot wider and reduces the natural friction of scales on steel, giving the razor a sloppy floppy feel. YMMV but I prefer sanding. There are two distinct regions to sand... The part toward the scale end from the pivot hole, and the area toward the body from the pivot hole. To guide the blade toward the show side scale, the region toward the body of the show side scale gets sanded, and the region toward the tip of the back side scale is sanded. Vice versa to steer it toward the back side scale. When the pin is peened the blade then centers, assuming the proper amount of material removal. You could also build up the opposite side with a smear of epoxy but I have never done that.

There are ways to straighten them to some extent though it poses some possible problems .
there are probably millions out there like this one. And this one worked just fine for what,, decades?
just build it. And there are lots of ways to overcome centering issues if it arises.

Thank you for your wisdom gentleman, I shall continue with the project and learn along the way.

 

[migralda]

Very late reply I realise but I use a wine cork to wrap the wet and dry paper around, it has just the right amount of give and resistance..i.e. moulds to the curve of the blade but enough pressure to sand.

 

[Dfarino]

So Glad I Found This Thread! I never would have thought of a wine cork!!

 

[mycarver]

Wine cork, section of garden hose , radiator hose, use some sandpaper to reshape an eraser ( a pinky or white one ) anything close to te curvature and then wrap it with either paper towel or a piece of craft foam (.99 a sheet.) a section of broom handle wrapped with the above items.
Just a few suggestions.

 

[Mr Brian]

I use a new wine cork and wrap it up with sand paper. That works for me. But, I like the thin layer of foam. New corks can be found at a home brew shop

 

[Chan Eil Whiskers]

Thank you, gentlemen. Great tips and ideas.

Happy shaves,

Jim