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Can Mantic59 Tame the R41?

Having used the R41 quite a bit, I'd have to say that it didn't work out (for me).

I was able to get a great shave with it, but I still had to do 3 passes + touch-ups. That's what I do for any safety razor. If the shave from the R41 was any closer than the others, it was by an insignificant amount. I still got my 5 o'clock shadow by 4:00 pm. And no, this was not after a half-hearted audition - I gave it several weeks.

Basically, the closest shave I can get is determined by my skin. Once I hit skin, no more hair is coming off without a proportional amount of skin too.

The disadvantage of the R41 over my other safeties is the fact that I constantly had to worry about it biting me. My Apollo or my Fasan slant give me as close a shave, but without the constant danger factor.

I can see the R41 being useful if you let your beard grow for several days in between shaves. Then it will take more off at a first pass than a mild razor. I shave every day, so this is not an advantage for me.

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Of course, other people get excellent shaves from it - comfortably. The only way to tell if it will work for you is to try it.
 
Seriously - if a guy with his experience gets that kind of result, why would anyone bother. Yeah, I know it might be in order to get a better shave. But how much better, and at what expense?

What determines what makes a 'better' shave? That's really the question.

I think that any of us could get a shave that's as close or closer than what we could get off an R41 if we did a 3-pass shave with a 5-blade cartridge razor. Hysteresis will almost certainly allow a closer shave than from a single-blade razor................especially if you do an ATG pass to finish up.

However, in my case that caused severe irritation and ingrowns.

So, I'd say that is not a good shave. The aim of shaving is to get a shave that is comfortable FIRST, and also close enough to be presentable through a workday (or into the night, if you're still at the nightclub stage). We all try and extend the time that our faces are smooth, but if we do that at the expense of comfort, it's a waste.
 
02:33 - Now I think I'll tempt fate with an against the grain pass.
02:36 - Oh wow, this feels like it might not be a good idea.

Ah, that had me laughing too. This was a funny one, especially with the editing. Next thing you know his face is cut up to all hell.
 
I want to try the R41.

My biggest problem is with slight irritation, bumps and ingrowns on my neck.

I've found that a great lather, skin stretching, a very sharp blade, and an extremely light touch are the keys to success.

My only problem is that the head on my Merkur HD isn't aggressive enough to get it in one pass. I think that the R41 could solve that problem, thereby eliminating the need to do an additional pass on my neck.

The key to using this razor is patience and technique. I will only use this Muhle if I have the time to do a good prep and an excellent lather.

Angle is key and it may take a few uses to get the feel of it. Use a sharp blade (I like Feathers), angle correctly, and use no pressure. Approach it like you are using a straight.

I find that I often can get a respectable shave in one pass with the grain.

An additional across the grain pass plus some small touch ups provide a bbs.

Good luck!
 
Of course, other people get excellent shaves from it - comfortably.

Yes but when you hear this you have to wonder if they are they being dead honest or just being "manly" online with bandages all over their face in the real world

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Great video, Mantic! After 42 years of Gillette Open Combs, I gave the 2011 R41 a try. Aggressive is an understatement, it can and does bite. I think my new pre-shave oil for it is Mobil 1 15W50. This razor really requires a steep angle and a sharp blade (a dull blade will really tug at the steep cutting angle). I shave every day, but after trying a few shaves with the R41, I found I can actually go a day without shaving after the R41. I have also found that it removes substantial amounts of upper layer skin cells; a BBS shave is had with only WTG & XTG passes. An ultra-slick cream or soap helps immeasurably, but, as other posters have stated, angle and minimal (read ZERO) contact pressure are foremost. Quite the Mühleskinner. I normally use a rotation of some of the popular creams & soaps mentioned on these forums, but for a quick test I tried one of the King of Shaves gels I use when traveling and it really made the R41 glide along the skin; but, getting some of the gel on my razor handle made it exceptionally slippery and difficult to manage. Fortunately, I discovered that the various handles for my Gillette heads from Bob's Razorworks also fit the R41 head. Now it's just a matter of matching up the proper BRW handle to the R41 head. YMMV with this razor! I give the R41 the same respect I give my pet "cat" who walks across me with eight "straights":
 
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Hmm, there's another recommendation for steep angle.... I don't get that. To me, a cutting type angle (shallow...cap close to face) makes more sense with so much blade exposure. A steep angle with the R41 is a scraping tool!

Great video, Mantic! After 42 years of Gillette Open Combs, I gave the 2011 R41 a try. Aggressive is an understatement, it can and does bite. I think my new pre-shave oil for it is Mobil 1 15W50. This razor really requires a steep angle and a sharp blade (a dull blade will really tug at the steep cutting angle). I shave every day, but after trying a few shaves with the R41, I found I can actually go a day without shaving after the R41. I have also found that it removes substantial amounts of upper layer skin cells; a BBS shave is had with only WTG & XTG passes. An ultra-slick cream or soap helps immeasurably, but, as other posters have stated, angle and minimal (read ZERO) contact pressure are foremost. Quite the Mühleskinner. I normally use a rotation of some of the popular creams & soaps mentioned on these forums, but for a quick test I tried one of the King of Shaves gels I use when traveling and it really made the R41 glide along the skin; but, getting some of the gel on my razor handle made it exceptionally slippery and difficult to manage. Fortunately, I discovered that the various handles for my Gillette heads from Bob's Razorworks also fit the R41 head. Now it's just a matter of matching up the proper BRW handle to the R41 head. YMMV with this razor! I give the R41 the same respect I give my pet "cat" who walks across me with eight "straights":
 
I've only shaved with my Muhle R41 six times, it being my latest acquisition after the Sledgehammer Merkur 39c which I've shaved with twenty-eight times. Although I must be more careful with the R41 than the Slant, and I can get a BBS shave from both, using the R41 seems to double the time before I start to notice stubble and shadow, from five hours to ten. It's nice to be able to feel clean shaven throughout the day and I almost skipped shaving this morning because I had so little beard from yesterday's shave. With both razors, I do a two pass (WTG, ATG) shave on my cheeks and neck (WTG only on my chin).

I have to be careful when I shave with the R41 since I share a single sink with my Wife and she likes to interrupt my shave routine to get in there to brush her teeth, etc. if I don't properly time it so that I'm shaving while she's in the shower.
 
I also gave it a good test run of a couple weeks. To be honest, I didn't receive any better of a shave than I get with my Slant or even my R89. It was a nice razor and did a good job, but it's results came out neutral for me. What was the deal breaker however, and othrs have said this too, is the shave felt rougher with the R41. I could feel the blade, the scraping feeling, and it just wasn't as comfortable to shave with. I didn't irritate or hurt myself, but it just wasn't comfortable.

That siad, just for kicks and to combat a bit of RAD, I may get one anyway. :wink2:
 
I see me getting one....eventually. I still get enough weepers with my current selection, from the looks of that, I could shave with a scythe and get better results!
Johnnie
 
I use the R41 most days. Usually I get a 1 pass DFS or 2 pass BBS. No nicks, no weepers, nice smooth comfortable shave.

Well, yesterday I tried a third pass ATG for the first time. Lets just say I feel Mantic's pain.
 
Mühleskinner
+1!

I've only had a half dozen shaves with the R41 and the jury is still out - I really do get a better shave on the parts that aren't raw, so I'll keep working on the magic touch. But it sure is a relief to go back to the Futur on weekdays...
 
I've actually put a flatedge gauge against the R41 head with a blade installed and the steeper angle between the bar comb-blade-cap tangent is really warranted; if you roll the razor up onto a narrow angle, where the flatedge becomes tangent to the comb and the cap, the blade actually starts to really dig in quite radically. It almost seems that there is no contact between the skin surface and the cap edge above the blade, if skin wasn't perhaps so elastic when shaving with it. I'll admit the first few times I tried the R41, I kept the angle more "traditional" and sliced the bejeebers out of my face. As Jamesspo stated above, it's almost like a scraper, and it does make some sound. If you are brave and steady of hand, just rest the bar/comb of the head with a blade installed along your finger, beginning with the head at 90º so there's no blade contact with your finger, then roll the handle upward, and you'll feel the blade beginning to touch at about 75º, and when you get to about 50º (between guard-blade-cap tangent line and your finger) you will feel how much the blade wants to dig into the surface of the skin. Just my quick empirical analysis. If I get some time, I may try to illustrate this with photographs.
 
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So, yeah I agree if you start with guard against your face, and lift upwards you get to a point where it's pretty uncomfortable. But I continue lifting until I just feel the cap (but blade still fully touching my skin). It's a very shallow angle, and gives a wonderful, straight-like shave in that mode. I don't feel like it's digging in at all at that angle.

I've actually put a flatedge gauge against the R41 head with a blade installed and the steeper angle between the bar comb-blade-cap tangent is really warranted; if you roll the razor up onto a narrow angle, where the flatedge becomes tangent to the comb and the cap, the blade actually starts to really dig in quite radically. It almost seems that there is no contact between the skin surface and the cap edge above the blade, if skin wasn't perhaps so elastic when shaving with it. I'll admit the first few times I tried the R41, I kept the angle more "traditional" and sliced the bejeebers out of my face. As Jamesspo stated above, it's almost like a scraper, and it does make some sound. If you are brave and steady of hand, just rest the bar/comb of the head with a blade installed along your finger, beginning with the head at 90º so there's no blade contact with your finger, then roll the handle upward, and you'll feel the blade beginning to touch at about 75º, and when you get to about 50º (between guard-blade-cap tangent line and your finger) you will feel how much the blade wants to dig into the surface of the skin. Just my quick empirical analysis. If I get some time, I may try to illustrate this with photographs.
 
Jamesspo, you've seem to have actually gone beyond the tangent point I was looking at with the R41 where the blade edge tends to dig in, and found a completely different approach to using this razor. Your technique sounds interesting and worth a try. Do you even feel the bar/comb on your face? I agree that it does provide a shave that is near straight in quality; even after just an XTG 2nd pass, I can't feel any stubble. The one thing that has never yet been mentioned is the close tolerance the R41 razor has for a blade. Regardless of brand, the blade fits snugly into the cap posts and at least in my R41s (x2) the blade exposure is equal and reproducible.
 
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